Should a nodepositer have the same chance?

[SpikeBlack]

I would personally prefer it if everyone had to deposit at least once a year. Say $10, just to keep their account alive.
Other than that and as it stands now, yes I think we should all have equal chance.

Then we'll get the people complaining that $10 isn't enough and that it should be $100 then a $1000. Or worse still you turn EU into a subscription game of $10 a month.

What incentive is there to skill and learn enough where you no longer need to deposit?

 

[mastermesh]

I would personally prefer it if everyone had to deposit at least once a year. Say $10, just to keep their account alive.
Other than that and as it stands now, yes I think we should all have equal chance.

Why? To encourage creation of alts if someone forgets to deposit on the 12th month in a row?

 

[Menace]

Yes a non depositor SHOULD and DOES have the same chance to hit it big. That being said... chances are still 1:1000000.

Menace

 

[RickEngland]

Good point Dan,

I fully agree, who cares what non depositors think, they are NOT the ones keeping this game alive
Angel

Harsh, but very true and too the point. +Rep for that.

The truth is you can deposit $200 on Friday. That gives you only 5 chances to get return (with 5 x 400 ammo runs), or 4 chances at 4 x 500 ammo runs. Not much chance if MA set you on 9 x 50-60% losing runs for the whole weekend (and that assumes you dont need new gear)

It's real money to the depositor, I don't see ANY stressed out non-depositors.

So quite frankly when depositors get treated like that, I also don't care what non depositors think. Becasue the game is harsh, it cares for no one.

Go cry that you went into McDaonalds sat down, and had to watch another guy next to you eat his Big Mac and fries, and you got nothing becasue you didn't go up to the counter and hand over your cash.

That is the reality of it.

There are some lucky ones that made some good investments in game so don't deposit anymore, but they did deposit for those investments, so that fine in my book.

Who is going to pay for this game, if there is no depositors? If we all went non-deposit you think the game would be here?

On the other side of the coin, why bother depositing, when the "Risk V Reward" is not working.

Rick

 

[LeeLoo Faith]

imho everyone should have same chance for everything.
... because:

Where do you make the cut?
Who is a depositer?

Someone who ONCE deposited 5 bucks?
someone who regulary deposits .. once a month, a week, a year?
someone who once deposited a huge amount as investment but dont deposit anymore?
is someone a depositer who used to depo each month but didnt depo for half a year / a year / two years?



or do you want blocks of possible hof sizes for total investment that someone ever had in Eu?
maybe getting smaller each year by 10% if deposits stopping?

 

[Asteraceae]

Good point Dan,

I fully agree, who cares what non depositors think, they are NOT the ones keeping this game alive

Hum, who kept the game alive ?
The one who depo bajillons dollars for get a ATH and only hunt huge mob, mine in FOMA and craft huge thing ?
Or maybe the one who don't depo, and stay at twin/PA/billy's only for chat and take time to help or talk to people ?

 

[ZAN ZAN]

The ones you skipped in your example, keep the game alive.

Hum, who kept the game alive ?
The one who depo bajillons dollars for get a ATH and only hunt huge mob, mine in FOMA and craft huge thing ?
Or maybe the one who don't depo, and stay at twin/PA/billy's only for chat and take time to help or talk to people ?

 

[johan roadkill]

I think I'd rather have poor people in game rather then rich people who didn't care for others only wished the poor people would go away and that MA would reward them for being able to afford wasting more money then others

 

[Magyar_Republic]

Look,

Every player keeps this game alive.

Depositors provide an influx of cash, whether they are heavy or sometime depositors, one thing this game should be teaching all players is that every penny counts.

Non depositors keep this game alive by providing numbers, a population of casual individuals attempting to conduct business. While the depositors move dollars back and forth, these folks move pennies. The key here is that for every 1 depositor there is likely 100 non depositors, every year. The cash moved by these folks, locked up by these folks into MA's system, and eventually assimilated back into the MA profit pool due to the accounts not being worth over $100 is HUGE.

In other words, non-depositors are in fact a source of income for MA because of the small amounts of cash they lock up from depositors. They are in essence this games piggy bank.

Without non-depositors depositors would vanish with complaints of how empty the game was.

Without depositors non depositors would vanish because who would they sell their free play goods to?

End the debate now about who is better than whom. It shows short sightedness, and does the arguer a disservice.

 

[ChairmanEdgewise]

don't try to "fix" something that doesn't need fixing is my answer to some of the posts ahead of me...


to OP: yeah they should have the same chance.

I do know for a fact that several ubers do not deposit, they only withdrawl money..

(there is nothing wrong with that btw )


Should they, after 1 year of being deposit "free", have a lowered chance of getting a hof or how long do they stay marked as a "depositor" ? Forever?

That wouldn't really work in the long run would it, lol...

"Make one deposit, get better loots for eternity!"




really really odd thread imo lol, some funny replies here tho

 

[Quint]

No. An nondepositor is a cost to the system so input should be motivated.

If a non-depositor cycles 2k ped per day, doesn't that provide enough "input" to the system you think ? Assuming he gets 90% or 95% back on TT values, he "pays" on average 200 or 100 ped to the system every day, which seems to be enough to me. He might actually support the system more than a depositor who cycles 1k ped per day.

So is it then the non-depositors fault that he knows what he is doing (a tip : managing markup) while the depositor does not care about markup and therefore loses his ass off most of the time ? I don't think so, both made a choice on the way they want to participate in EU and both should be respected imo.

 

[Fanan]

If a non-depositor cycles 2k ped per day, doesn't that provide enough "input" to the system you think ? Assuming he gets 90% or 95% back on TT values, he "pays" on average 200 or 100 ped to the system every day, which seems to be enough to me. He might actually support the system more than a depositor who cycles 1k ped per day.

...

Why is ppl so naive?


This game only exist because ppl depoed real money (USD)!

Remove that and no matter how much you cycle or the fees you pay at auction or etc. Those are all virtual! It's all zeros and ones nothing more! Or do you think MA pay salaries and bills with PED?

Example:
I could have a 300k ATH but until I withdrawal it all MA still wins, cause they still have all my USD that I depo over the years and all I got is 1 and 0 digits (computer language) on a screen that worth nothing...


And to the op ofc my aswer is Yes. Time is money... no matter where or how you got the ped budget to play with. But if you cycle like the others the chances should be the same.

 

[Coelacanth]

My answer, to concur with the majority of responses, is "of course" non-depositors should have the same chance to HOF. Just because someone isn't depositing doesn't mean they aren't paying a LOT of money to MA from decay of their stuff.

In 10 years I've deposited less than $300 USD, and $200 of that was only the last 6 months. But I assure you, MA has made *thousands* from my repaired items over the years.

As far as HOFs go, I'm still looking for my first uber. As a level 48 all naturally-skilled hunter, I feel like I bloody well deserve it regardless of how much I've deposited.

 

[Fanan]

Not saying that nodepositers don't help the virtual game economy but to provide RL profit to MA never!

Are we all grown ups or what? How can something that doesn't exist (virtual) provide anything at all in real world?

 

[Quint]

Why is ppl so naive?


This game only exist because ppl depoed real money (USD)!

Remove that and no matter how much you cycle or the fees you pay at auction or etc. Those are all virtual! It's all zeros and ones nothing more! Or do you think MA pay salaries and bills with PED?

Example:
I could have a 300k ATH but until I withdrawal it all MA still wins, cause they still have all my USD that I depo over the years and all I got is 1 and 0 digits (computer language) on a screen that worth nothing...

Euhm, I am fully aware of that. All the peds which are currently owned by non-depositors, once came into the system via depositors, no doubt about that (disregarding the tt values of sweat, Xmas gifts, etc... for argument's sake).

I also fully understand that peds are worthless irl up untill the moment you withdraw them.

So where am I being naive ?

 

[Fanan]

My answer, to concur with the majority of responses, is "of course" non-depositors should have the same chance to HOF. Just because someone isn't depositing doesn't mean they aren't paying a LOT of money to MA from decay of their stuff.

...

How do you pay with something that don't exist? please explain to me.

 

[Fanan]

Euhm, I am fully aware of that. All the peds which are currently owned by non-depositors, once came into the system via depositors, no doubt about that (disregarding the tt values of sweat, Xmas gifts, etc... for argument's sake).

I also fully understand that peds are worthless irl up untill the moment you withdraw them.

So where am I being naive ?

here when you say "He might actually support the system more than a depositor who cycles 1k ped per day."

Suport what system? not the real one for sure...

To help more the ingame economy... yes probably. On real life purposes I bet MA prefere the one that depo, even if he will never cycle those peds...

 

[minim]

here when you say "He might actually support the system more than a depositor who cycles 1k ped per day."

Suport what system? not the real one for sure...

To help more the ingame economy... yes probably. On real life purposes I bet MA prefere the one that depo, even if he will never cycle those peds...

He will generate activity that would not be there without the non-depositor. In that way supplying the demand for a depositing hunter/crafter/miner. Without activity this game will die pretty quick (and so will it if everyone became a non-depoer but that's another discussion).

 

[mastermesh]

Not saying that nodepositers don't help the virtual game economy but to provide RL profit to MA never!

Are we all grown ups or what? How can something that doesn't exist (virtual) provide anything at all in real world?

non-depositors hold assets. Those are assets that depositors can't TT. Those are assets with markup many times. As mentioned in another post, non-depositors keep depositors from cashing out as easily. That does provide profit to Mindark... as do the many thousands of auctions non-depositors create. You can't find it now since they killed off the affiliate program, but when it existed there was a chart and some descriptions in there that explained that half of auction fee went to Planet Partner and Half went to Mindark. For every auction non-depositors make, they are making cash for Mindark in that way.

 

[Quint]

here when you say "He might actually support the system more than a depositor who cycles 1k ped per day."

Suport what system? not the real one for sure...

A ok, thx for clearing that.

I believe that MA generates income from the tt value which gets "lost" by anyone from performing ingame activities. So the more active you are ingame (measured in peds cycled), the more income you generate for MA. But obviously I do agree with you that those peds originally must have come from someone who deposited rl money and converted them into peds. So it actually means that the more peds non-depositors are able to cycle without losing money, the more needs to be "lost" by depositors. Here is an example which might clarify my view on the system :

Player A deposits 100USD and gets 1000 ped (disregarding any transaction fees atm). He buys a gun with 200 ped tt value for 200% from a non-depositor player B, so for 400ped. He then cycles the remaining 600 ped once, causing his gun to decay 50 ped and tt's all his loot, worth 585 ped.

At first they have :

Player A : 1000 ped
Player B : 200 ped (tt of gun)
MA : 0 ped

Each then has :

Player A : 585+150=735 ped
Player B : 400 ped
MA : 65 ped

So MA "earned" 65 ped, or in other words : they have 65 peds less which anyone can claim back.

 

[Fanan]

non-depositors hold assets. Those are assets that depositors can't TT. Those are assets with markup many times. As mentioned in another post, non-depositors keep depositors from cashing out as easily.

I agree.

That does provide profit to Mindark... as do the many thousands of auctions non-depositors create. You can't find it now since they killed off the affiliate program, but when it existed there was a chart and some descriptions in there that explained that half of auction fee went to Planet Partner and Half went to Mindark. For every auction non-depositors make, they are making cash for Mindark in that way.

How come? The no depo player just for creating an auction (paying fee with virtual currency) is providing healthy to Mindark?

I though that was the way, since we now have more than one planet partner, to find out how to split the true money, the USD!

Believe in what you want, PED should be tied to USD but we also know that if all the players rushed to withdrawal there wouldn't be enought USD for all. So things aren't so simple and I can't believe that a virtual currency pays anything in this real world!

 

[minim]

Believe in what you want, PED should be tied to USD but we also know that if all the players rushed to withdrawal there wouldn't be enought USD for all.

And this is why I don't get why ppl believe that "MA makes money on repair/decay" MA make money the second you deposit. What you decide to use it on they couldn't care less about. They just make sure that your tt return isn't above 100% for any activity ingame so they know that they won't have to give you all your money back

 

[Coelacanth]

How do you pay with something that don't exist? please explain to me.

Simple, if you believe MA's claims that they only make money from decay, anyone who uses any item is giving MA income.

 

[Harmony.]

*sighs*

Let's just face it. This game can't function without depositers and non-depositors.

Non-depositors should realize that the precious markup comes from people that deposit peds into the system, and they should be grateful that other people actually keep this game running.

Depositors should realize that non-depositors do all the dirty jobs (sweating/mining/hunting boring mobs with MU) so that you can enjoy the game to the fullest. You wouldn't like some markups if there were only depositors in this game.

Ingame everyone should have the same loot-rules, else people will stop playing and the game will die.

This doesn't mean that depositors can't get a little bonus when depositing (this has happened before and will probably happen again). But it should always be a bonus, and not a right.

I consider myself to be a non-depositor btw.

 

[somon90]

What people here seem to fail to understand here is that money does not come from nowhere, The peds that a non-depositor use are not simply stolen from MindArks pocket...
People that don't deposit bring in quite a bit of money to MA and are a very integral part of the Entropian universe we all know and love( at times).

All earnings that a non-depositer gets are in fact money that someone else has deposited into the game. These peds are not in any way stolen, rather the opposite, always willingly given for the service that the non-depositor offers.
Non-depositors actually indirectly bring a lot of Peds into our world.

Think about the humble sweater, this core player that many of you seem to call a thief of MAs valued assets.
The sweaters surely must make money directly from MA you say, but what money is that exactly?
If you recall Sweat actually close to no value at all from MAs side, from whence comes this value then? You might ask.
It is quite simple really, the value of sweat is the amount of peds that people are willing to pay.
Someone might be interested in skilling some mindforce, thus this person buys mind essence, he might deposit to do this. If he buys it using money that he made from sweating it really is the same, that money has always been deposited by someone else

The case is the same for all non depositors, traders for example make their money by making it easier for people to sell their things, and if they hunt or mine or pay for the service of someone else the money goes back into the system. These traders also actively make MA money by the fees in their shops and on the auction.

Depositors are a vital part of this universe, it is true that they bring in money to this world, but so does the people that don't deposit.
You might think that a exempt here is the people that regularly withdraw money, but know that they are entirely right to do so, that money has already went trough the system and thickened MAs pockets. It is rightfully theirs.

One real exception is people that make their money by fucking the system, these people you can blame, but don't claim that non-depositors bring less money to the universe than you do.

I think that it should be absolutely ridiculous if MA would give incitements to depositing people that are anything but token in nature.
The examples in this thread, of handing depositors valuable vehicles, unlimited weaponry, skills and higher chances of Hoffing strike me as absolutely absurd.
If the changes proposed in this thread where to be realized where made Entropia might have a temporary influx of currency, know well that the instabilities created in the system by doing this probably would hurt Entropia massively in the long term... I surely wouldn't want to live in such a universe.

Note.
I am a depositor myself and did for quite some time literally convert all my available funds into peds every month. At the moment I deposit a bit less, but I try to deposit a couple of hundred Peds USD each month.

 

[Fanan]

And this is why I don't get why ppl believe that "MA makes money on repair/decay" MA make money the second you deposit. What you decide to use it on they couldn't care less about. They just make sure that your tt return isn't above 100% for any activity ingame so they know that they won't have to give you all your money back

Exactly.

Simple, if you believe MA's claims that they only make money from decay, anyone who uses any item is giving MA income.

I don't, sorry. And those who believe it, on my opinion are being very naive.

 

[Farmer Smurf]

The difference between a deposit player, and a non depo player..

Comes down to desire, give enough time and reasons to deposit, and the non depo player, will eventually turn to deposits...Took me a little over 2 years to make the switch, but doubt there is any going back now

 

[Coelacanth]

I don't, sorry. And those who believe it, on my opinion are being very naive.

Regardless of what YOU (or even I) believe, I made my point and I'm far from naive. I didn't just fall off the turnip cart yesterday. I fell off it almost 6 years before you did.

 

[valentin]

We all know that MA is a business and they want paying customers, then the question is what are good customers and bad customers any kind of feedback should be like in any other business to take care of the customers they want.

The solution should be I do not know, but my thoughts are that good paying customers should have the better of the game is not necessary to make a profit, but be more comfortable gaming experience in their skill class through to loot items that make the game more to delight so they want to spend more money in here.

Their success was in 2003-2006 since it has gone slowly backwards all the time - why. Instead of inserting a massive advertising by the year 2006, they decided to just make nerfs until 2012 at the end of the year 2012, they have tried to do some desperate actions but it may be too late because the reputation of the game is in the bottom.

 

[BB Global]

Just adding a layer of information here, 10years ago (I've read) sweat sold for massive prices, and several "dotcom-bubbles" occurred in loot like lvl 1 extractors etc... the easiest level 1 bp became the most expensive material etc etc.


I think the main cause for (already labelled necro-thread) concern is not which skill level is getting the HOF (I pursued risky activities with my Cornundacauda HOF, but kept my flame pattern shirt ), but how easy is it for either to start ingame anymore.

Example - 2003 avatar claims to be a non-depositor. This non-depo avatar made 10 years of skills! TEN. They now hit harder than a new depositor.

2003 avatar has deposited from day 1, is now an uber and has paid enough for their skills in 10 years they basically withdraw money, likely beyond their initial years of investment.

2006/7/8 avatar managed to take advantage of several opportunities and now hits higher than a new depositor, depositor at the time or not.

2013 depositor cannot hunt anything effectively for MU without the buyers being willing to buy this MU item (can/wont)

2013 non-depositor successfully completed Viper's newbie rewards programme and won the monthly prize (massive) and is now a trader.

There are a few negative experiences in the above outcomes, like people that wanted the place to grow leaving, or people that would never withdraw missing an ATH to someone that wants to withdraw.

MA want to pay their bills, pay their wages, buy their houses, pay to keep enticing features developing - Planet Partners would have flavour-of-the-month items like CAP-202 (very eco with Hotfoot15) or Herb Box for a steady stream as well as the primary objectives.

MU - If it is life or death someone else is incharge unfortunately "I wouldn't buy from that guy he's a reseller"/"Only this guy".