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Swamp/sweat camp

Charlie|Calypso said:
I am actually not going to change Port Atlantis or the swamp camp over there at all.

Personally I would prefer another location to be the starter area, as I think PA is a bit to much to take in all at once for a new player and can be pretty confusing (even to old players).
I am currently working on a new city better suited for newbies to possibly be used as a new "arrival area", with less long distance running, easy access to terminals, mobs, teleporters etc. The plan is to have this new swamp camp located close to this start area and to also have a spawn of a tougher mob nearby, to encourage a mix of players of various levels.

Maybe you will even see the return of some long lost mob...:yup:
Click to expand...

Atlas Haven perhaps? Used to be a fun place with low level mobs, Snable, Diakiba, Exa etc.

https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...re-Atlas-Island-spawns-to-how-it-was-pre-VU10
 
This seems to be a repeat of what most people are saying (and glad to say that too), but the openness of the area was key to swamp camp being useful. You could actually see who you were talking to, and for those of us who were healers, or other mindforce skillers, see who needed the help. The spawns helped too, of course. Your new puny versions of mobs are nice for low level hunters, but too much hassle for sweaters. The combibo, bercycled and daikiba made a nice mix for that. When I was a newcommer to the game, I found the place on my own without any directions or mission brokers because it was relatively easy to find. With a turret on one end, and water to drown the mobs on the other, it was an ideal area that was "unbusy". There are no such places like that on Calypso anymore. Everything is jazzed up and fast paced in design. The old swamp camp was not. It was a place you could slow down, relax, chat, and skill a bit, and that is why it worked.
 
sledgehammer said:
This seems to be a repeat of what most people are saying (and glad to say that too), but the openness of the area was key to swamp camp being useful. You could actually see who you were talking to, and for those of us who were healers, or other mindforce skillers, see who needed the help. The spawns helped too, of course. Your new puny versions of mobs are nice for low level hunters, but too much hassle for sweaters. The combibo, bercycled and daikiba made a nice mix for that. When I was a newcommer to the game, I found the place on my own without any directions or mission brokers because it was relatively easy to find. With a turret on one end, and water to drown the mobs on the other, it was an ideal area that was "unbusy". There are no such places like that on Calypso anymore. Everything is jazzed up and fast paced in design. The old swamp camp was not. It was a place you could slow down, relax, chat, and skill a bit, and that is why it worked.
Click to expand...

:wise:
I agree with my fellow MD'er :p
 
Charlie|Calypso said:
I am actually not going to change Port Atlantis or the swamp camp over there at all.

Personally I would prefer another location to be the starter area, as I think PA is a bit to much to take in all at once for a new player and can be pretty confusing (even to old players).
I am currently working on a new city better suited for newbies to possibly be used as a new "arrival area", with less long distance running, easy access to terminals, mobs, teleporters etc. The plan is to have this new swamp camp located close to this start area and to also have a spawn of a tougher mob nearby, to encourage a mix of players of various levels.

Maybe you will even see the return of some long lost mob...:yup:
Click to expand...

mmm, like Ft Troy maybe? relatively flat, but certain mobs to the Northwest and Northeast would have to be moved farther away and the trees thinned some more. And with enclosed walls would certainty help to separate mob spawn areas out the gate. Though I would suggest young allo's to the south, not the esto's that are there on the beach.
 
Charlie|Calypso said:
I am actually not going to change Port Atlantis or the swamp camp over there at all.

Personally I would prefer another location to be the starter area, as I think PA is a bit to much to take in all at once for a new player and can be pretty confusing (even to old players).
I am currently working on a new city better suited for newbies to possibly be used as a new "arrival area", with less long distance running, easy access to terminals, mobs, teleporters etc. The plan is to have this new swamp camp located close to this start area and to also have a spawn of a tougher mob nearby, to encourage a mix of players of various levels.

Maybe you will even see the return of some long lost mob...:yup:
Click to expand...

Do you mean like before, where there was an area just off of pa, just more complex?

So some newbie city a bit off, and after leaving, takes you to port atlantis via missions?


It would be real damn shame if you turned pa into a ghost town with these plans, as its a important part of calypso's history.

Especially since its supposed to be the capital city...

first possible move by the new devs that i feel they could be bullzoding calypso
 
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Stave said:
Do you mean like before, where there was an area just off of pa, just more complex?

So some newbie city a bit off, and after leaving, takes you to port atlantis via missions?
Click to expand...

I still think my suggestion earlier in the thread would fit the best for this, with a few tweaks ofc :)

Link: https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/...p-sweat-camp&p=2915217&viewfull=1#post2915217



Would give a new less confusing start, along with incorporating Port Atlantis (as I said, with a few tweaks).




EDIT: Another possibility I see is giving Port Atlantis more importance LATER in the game, and putting it as the gateway to Amathera that you have to cross before being allowed to go to the new islands or Amathera. Could also be given related quests, missions, etc.

If this happened, Port Atlantis would still have a use while some other place, in my opinion preferably a slightly altered Atlas Haven (with restored spawns per the thread linked by Mega above), could get the role of Newbie Town (this would make it possible to add a new sweating camp in the north or northeast part of the Atlas Island as well, and putting it close to Limnadian District for that type of sweating if a newbie prefers that over solo or small groups).
 
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Infact, vu10, pa died because the swamp had all facilitys, then this current pa brought some life back, however, pa trade never ever recovered from it.

So i really dont see how you can do your plans without effectively killing off port atlantis, which is very sad for me, and no doubt many others.
 
as long as it has small kerberos im fine :D
 
Charlie|Calypso said:
I have heard a lot of people don't really like the current swamp camp at Port Atlantis and i have some plans on improving/making a new one with better functionality, more like the old ones.
I have a general idea of what I'm going to do but my memory is a bit fuzzy when it comes to the old ones, except for the Camp Phoenix one.

So i thought i would let you all share with me what elements you think is needed to create/recreate the swamp camp of your dreams, pictures and paint drawings allowed!:sweat:
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Yes thats true because most ppl wants the old sweat camp back how it was and the animal taming.
With other words like it was before.:wise:

The old sweat camp was fun this we have today is soooo boring.

We miss the old minipolis to and all the small places we could discover.

This new calypso after VU 10.0 is boring and just made ​​to increase the damage to the avatars.
But the atmosphere of a planet to discover is gone.

just such a detail that avatars could talk adds atmosphere really very much, today's calypso has no charm its just to spent money.

The planet today feels more like a factory then a game ---> you have faild.
 
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From my point of view:

I think (personal opinion) that game designers today try to squeeze every last flop of power out of computer systems. They build their world around what is possible from a 2D processing system, to deliver an abstract picture of their 3D world, including as much detail as possible to give the illusion of real.

There is an oversight, one that the digital world has long forgotten, and that is the processing capability of the human brain. It is a 3D processor much more powerful at piecing together abstract concepts to form it's own reality.

From personal experience, I feel much more mentally rewarded for using my own imagination - taking in only small snippets or cross sections of ideas, and integrating them into one concept to form a larger picture. The larger picture is mine, and everyone else will have their own.

Building a realistic, 3D interactive environment around the player is the main goal of any game designer, but I think having too much unnecessary detail limits the imagination of the player. People like to use their imagination and think for themselves - it is an empowering feeling. Being spoon fed unlimited detail that is not relevant to our lives is tiring, exhausting, and eventually we develop a repulsive tendency towards it.

Less detail can fuel the imagination; we are not bound by the details that surround us. Take away the unnecessary and whatever detail remains, is suggestive enough for the player to use their own minds and to create a more positive and optimistic representation of the world they are inhabiting.

what is the best way to define an attraction to a system or idea? my opinion would be; the less repulsive a system is, higher the probability of being attracted to it.

Likewise, the less detail the system has(to a degree of the player not having to think too hard to formulate an idea of what is going on), the more a player can build their own idea of the world - and their own imagination - they rarely think repulsive.

Distributed load-balancing with the human mind.

Long winded way of saying: more open-plan, less clutter.
 
Charlie|Calypso said:
I am actually not going to change Port Atlantis or the swamp camp over there at all.

Personally I would prefer another location to be the starter area, as I think PA is a bit to much to take in all at once for a new player and can be pretty confusing (even to old players).
I am currently working on a new city better suited for newbies to possibly be used as a new "arrival area", with less long distance running, easy access to terminals, mobs, teleporters etc. The plan is to have this new swamp camp located close to this start area and to also have a spawn of a tougher mob nearby, to encourage a mix of players of various levels.

Maybe you will even see the return of some long lost mob...:yup:
Click to expand...

Just put in the old PA before VU 10.0
 
It is also worth noting that part of the reason PA remained vibrant and active was because the revive at swamp had only the revive, repair, and tt terminals. You had to go back to PA to store, and it is also worth noting that you didn't have any fish in the surrounding waters, so the swim back to PA was a safe one.

Edit: Also important was the swamp camp was on a different server than PA, allowing both to be busy at the same time without causing lag.
 
Sorry to hear that swamp camp is not being touched.
Your post did not sound like you was asking for ideas other than to Swamp Camp.

If it's another location, it's not swamp camp, but somewhere else.
I feel this wont be populated like 'The original Swamp' and will just die off as hardly anyone will be there. It's not to different than people just running off into the wild to form little sweat/swunt groups, like the allo/esto area.

If it is the newbie arrival area, I fear the newbies will be sent down to an empty area that no vets will hardly ever use. Of course, I could be wrong, but whether it retains the feeling of being a little area of combibo/daiks/bery, and a little further afield, molisk, tripudion and kerbs, plus the pvp area, next to a Capital City, that always was populated, remains to be seen.

All I will say then is good luck on the spot you choose, and ask that the spot you do chose is not full of cliffs, mountains, and vegetation.

As to a snazzy name for it, let me be the 1st to suggest one :)
The Salty Plains
Not Mount Entroperest, or Calypazon (see the pun)
 
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Charlie|Calypso said:
Personally I would prefer another location to be the starter area, as I think PA is a bit to much to take in all at once for a new player and can be pretty confusing (even to old players).
Click to expand...

Sound a bit stupid to me to first make PA the newbee area with all the missions attached to it, and then decide it isn't the right place for newcomers, effectively turning PA into a ghost town.

I do agree though that PA isn't the best place, a shame of all the work that was put into it.
 
My main isssue with sweating as it is now is the stupid tool. Sweating is supose to be mind force imo. I loved swamp camp pre VU 10. Sure you must be able to make an exact replica ;) Sweating pre VU 10 was a great way to relax when loot was bad or after a long run of hunting. Now i bearly do it anymore since the "new and improved" way to sweat. Hard time seeing the improvment thou :confused:
 
Wed said:
My main isssue with sweating as it is now is the stupid tool. Sweating is supose to be mind force imo.
Click to expand...

Agreed, I very much prefered the old sweating... even though we had no autotool back then, at least you did not lose focus from the mob moving a quarter of an inch sideways.

+ It looked much cooler :)
 
Wed said:
My main isssue with sweating as it is now is the stupid tool. Sweating is supose to be mind force imo. I loved swamp camp pre VU 10. Sure you must be able to make an exact replica ;) Sweating pre VU 10 was a great way to relax when loot was bad or after a long run of hunting. Now i bearly do it anymore since the "new and improved" way to sweat. Hard time seeing the improvment thou :confused:
Click to expand...

I can understand you and i remeber you from the old swamp camp it was fun there.:yay:
I did not sweat so much there but i did lot of healing there.
 
Nighthawk said:
Agreed, I very much prefered the old sweating... even though we had no autotool back then, at least you did not lose focus from the mob moving a quarter of an inch sideways.

+ It looked much cooler :)
Click to expand...

And the Aya-aya-aya Drum beat.


But even then, I don't think it's a major factor.
Personalized experience, or a personal challenge is kinda important,
where someone can go: "I gotta get through this, to see what's next".

How about this:

Today's sweat camp should be more like a mid-way, its kinda darkish, but not dangerous enough.

so what if there's 2 additional areas,
1. A light looking very easy mob (pre VU10)- 1 day noobs - 1 noob sweating a single mob
2. Today's sweat camp (darkish but not dangerous)- 7 day noobs - 7 noobs per mob
3. Dark and maybe kinda dangerous, 3rd zone - 1 month noobs - 30 noobs per mob

Also, you gotta think about how to organize people into bunches, to make em wanna come back.

Here's my bunch!


Re-implement the sitting! Cause this started by someone sitting down, then someone sat next to him and so on. Maybe more actions for people to copy each other?

There was alot more in pre VU10, so don't think that just by working on one thing you can fix everything..
Getting back to where we were might be a good start. Alot of individuality has been lost.
 
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umbranoids!!!!!!!!!!!! Those are what hooked me into this game. I remember starting in Atlas Haven and running east and crossing by the umbranoid camp. After dying from those things several times, my new mission was to deposit, buy some gear, and get revenge!!


PS: Remake Atlas haven to how it used to be and bring back atlas north as the new swamp camp. It's directly in the middle of the map basically.. not far from linmadian, and the surrounding mobs are fairly easy to kill for newer players with some gear.

My 2 cents!
 
Just a thought...what about an area that is accessible only by teleport to and from port atlantis. You could give it every property that the old swamp camp had without having to rearrange the map. It could be somewhat of a time travel concept like Greece, except we travel back to a swamp camp that looks much like the 9.4 version. You could even put a couple npc daikiba stalkers as a tribute to the old swamp (bonus points if you make one of them the actual tp)

Edit: this would allow you to turn off the day/night settings which are so irritating to sweat groups.
 
Flatter area (but. It shouldn't look barren and dead)
Easy access to terminals and revive outside.

Mobs:

Close to rev:
Bibo
Berry
Daik

Further away:
Molisk
Kerb
(maybe even the occasional drone abit further away then that)

And punys on the way to the camp

(also non related to the camp give pa a market place

Then something I saw a few mention which I didn't realy agree with at first but.. A pvpring would bring more chatter and potential healers there aswell as entertainment
 
We have a good deal of viable sweating areas right now. Theyre not used not because there's a problem with these areas. By and large theyre all very viable, including one that is very similar to vu10 PA sweat camp and has lots of similarities to the features requested here. It's not a clone copy of pre vu10 (which I think some people want out of some obsessive compulsive desire to roll back the clock), but it has berycled & snables on one beach, high density bibos in the middle next to a TT and revive, midrange hunting Feffoid/Armax/Molisk/Morisusilex on another beach, and high level argos nearby for more experienced players.

As I was saying, no problem with sweatable areas. It's that there's very little reason to actually sweat. It's worthless at 2 PED / Hour to do. Players cant survive off of that in a meaningful way, leading to a decline in the economy for free players. Another sweat camp wont fix this. It will just bring the frustration closer to home.

Really sweating needs an overhaul. It's only marginally useful.
 
How about moving it closer to PA (if not already done) last time i seen it it took 10 mins to get there.

ANd do not allow people to spawn their cars/planes/boats or whatever - because some people are idiots and will spawn 5 - as if that is impressive or something - pets were ok bcuse they kinds fit in.

And definately get rid of that stupid stupid sweat tool and bring back to old sweat dance :)
 
MachineLife said:
How about moving it closer to PA (if not already done) last time i seen it it took 10 mins to get there.

ANd do not allow people to spawn their cars/planes/boats or whatever - because some people are idiots and will spawn 5 - as if that is impressive or something - pets were ok bcuse they kinds fit in.

And definately get rid of that stupid stupid sweat tool and bring back to old sweat dance :)
Click to expand...

As I said. Obsessive Compulsive Desire to roll back the clock. This is asking for pre vu10 sweating to come in. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the sweat tool, and tbh it actually makes more sense than waving your arms magically in the air and then sucking sweat from a mob with your brain. Fundamentally folks that started at vu10 had absolutely no problem with sweating. It isnt broken.

And a flat surface to sweat in is completely unnecessary.

The problem is there is no incentive to sweat. It's a waste of time.
 
Magyar_Republic said:
As I said. Obsessive Compulsive Desire to roll back the clock. This is asking for pre vu10 sweating to come in. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the sweat tool, and tbh it actually makes more sense than waving your arms magically in the air and then sucking sweat from a mob with your brain. Fundamentally folks that started at vu10 had absolutely no problem with sweating. It isnt broken.

And a flat surface to sweat in is completely unnecessary.

The problem is there is no incentive to sweat. It's a waste of time.
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Well all i know is sweating used to be fun as you could chat easly and not lose focus all the time etc..

was a lot of fun seeing 15-20 green beams hitting a Ambu wish i could find the screenie I took

I dont think bringing back something that was fun is "turning back the clock" it just was better (or more fun to me at least)

If i wanted to turn back the clock I would say "get rid of re-gen" and spawning mobs on top of palyers, and stuff like that.
 
Magyar_Republic said:
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the sweat tool, and tbh it actually makes more sense than waving your arms magically in the air and then sucking sweat from a mob with your brain.
Click to expand...

I have to disagree with this part: Sweating is and always has been MindForce and that is something you do with your mind (enhanced and focused by the implant (and chip if needed)) so it makes less sense to use a machine to do it and still get MindForce skills :scratch2:



Anyways, sweating is pointless now but adding a load of new MindForce buff, support and leisure chips along with giving more use to synch chips could increase sweat prices. Adding a "hypercharged fuel" using sweat + oil (more sweat than oil) for a speed boost could increase sweat prices.

Together, those two things could perhaps increase it to a decent level. Making some MindForce chips craftable and using sweat in the formula could also increase it (not attack, but some more buff type chips that does not matter AS MUCH if they are a tiny bit less eco (higher markup) due to using sweat).



In my opinion, approx. 5PED per 1k sweat should be a good balance to let people try the game out without having to work hard for a week first, but still low enough for most older players not to go back to sweating instead of depositing.

EDIT: Asking them to try and make the price go higher is simple greed. Asking it to remain low because "sweaters do not contribute" is complete ignorance of how things work. That'll be all.
 
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