abuse by pirate using summonfucntion

[Teiwaz Storm]

Some easy solutions to this problem:

- Implementing confirmation message for passengers when they are 'invited' to guest list of vehicle (why somebody would be able to add me to their vehicle if I do not wish so?)
- Implementing list of vehicles where we are passengers/pilots/etc. with ability to remove ourselves from selected vehicle's guest list
- Implementing that passenger might be removed from guest list (and ejected in space) might be only done when docked at Space Station (prevents all types of pirate scams)

 

[OZtwo]

No is not, this is a game where lootable pvp are an important component.

Here we go again. But you REALLY need to think about what you are saying here and what lootable pvp really means here in a RCE. The question really is it legal for MA to have such a system in a RCE. And yes, please I know a lot of people will be saying this or that about why it's just simply ok to steal in a 'game' and not really understand what it is that MA has done here.

This is not just a game. This is a RCE! See on your line of thinking this problem we are having is well, not an issue at all. Hell, scamming wouldn't be an issue since it's a PART OF THE GAME! See this is a game, and part of the game is to find your way around the legal (exploits) boundaries.

Yes, I know I know..but come on.

 

[trance]

No is not, this is a game where lootable pvp are an important component. The issues is that they are misusing the system and drags players that don't want to be in pvp space and attacks them.

I think this say all!

 

[Lighterthief]

Here we go again. But you REALLY need to think about what you are saying here and what lootable pvp really means here in a RCE.

but the other side of the coin is.....
without pvp the whole space travel market has just been popped, if theres no pvp then we'd all be flying everywhere in quads loaded with stackables and there would be no need for any organised space travel.

so yeah, theres more aspects to this than just "damn pirates"

 

[Granny Rowan]

the summon window is the real problem

Some easy solutions to this problem:

- Implementing confirmation message for passengers when they are 'invited' to guest list of vehicle (why somebody would be able to add me to their vehicle if I do not wish so?)
- Implementing list of vehicles where we are passengers/pilots/etc. with ability to remove ourselves from selected vehicle's guest list
- Implementing that passenger might be removed from guest list (and ejected in space) might be only done when docked at Space Station (prevents all types of pirate scams)

While I agree.. there should be a right to refuse an add to a guest list.. or a means of self removal.. like with FL.
The main bugbear is the summon message window
1. Please MA explain why is it in the middle of the screen.. the exact place we click when hunting, dig up a claim etc. If this was moved to the side of the screen.. or better yet player could choose where.. then less likely to have accidental accept.
This has happened to most of us at some point.. scammers and pirates aside.

2. Why not double click accept.. just like a trade..
Responsibility to check remains with the player.. removes some but not all of the risk.

While looting in space is an accepted risk for travellers and indeed a designed feature of the game, the effect of an unwanted pirate summon on a new playe,r who 1 minute ago was quietly skilling on punies is horrid. As previously stated many are then left stuck in space, looted clean and pedless.. many will not yet have depoed, be surprised if many don't quit and spead the word that this game is Sh--. Which it isn't..

Come on Pirates wake up is it really worth 3 pec of loot (less after ammo) to destroy the very people who could become a rich and legitimate target in say 6 months.
This scam is bred from extreme greed and plain old fashioned nastiness imo.. it is not gameplay it doesn't even make financial sense.

 

[billairboy]

I think this say all!

And by that you mean?

 

[Lorthis]

I agree 100% ... and it doesn't matter how long it takes to collect data or make a decision on what to do, not making a public and official statement to this community for this long is just unacceptable, and not putting something into place to make our universe more secure in this respect is also unacceptable.

This is definitely not the way to do business.

Yea totally agree... Not even a temp ban for the perpetrators to investigate anything, so they just continue their exploit...
As long as this is the attitude of MA (not giving a flying f.) I am gonna give EU break.

 

[Kitch]

Additionally, for the ones that have problems getting a satisfactory reply from support, use the information coming from MA themselves. Observe here their own Entropia Universe - Space Guide:




Therefore keeping the guestlist open with the intention to take personal financial advantage by looting people using an unintended feature can be labelled an exploit. They should have reported the flaw when discovered instead of abusing it for personal financial gain. Bannable without a doubt.

I'm bit confused, I am not on windys FL but was added to the GL?

whatever.. it sucks ass in every way. Its an omni-shambles.

 

[Drachenherz]

but the other side of the coin is.....
without pvp the whole space travel market has just been popped, if theres no pvp then we'd all be flying everywhere in quads loaded with stackables and there would be no need for any organised space travel.

so yeah, theres more aspects to this than just "damn pirates"

So and what are the benefits for this game to FORCE people in lootbale pvp zones huh?
This is legalized robbery with real money.

What kind of players do you want in here?
You already have enough leeches, cheaters etc... cause of the RCE. Enough said, i saw this coming as it was realesed.

 

[Kitch]

3. Disable summon function for now. I've already written that I don't like the idea as it affects all ships, but I see it as a temporary solution if all other brainpower fails...

I hate that thing if im honest, even when its only an innocent summons to a friends ship. Just want it to not affect my hunts/activities anymore, and that moment of minor panic it causes sometimes :-I

 

[GeorgeSkywalker]

I agree 100% ... and it doesn't matter how long it takes to collect data or make a decision on what to do, not making a public and official statement to this community for this long is just unacceptable, and not putting something into place to make our universe more secure in this respect is also unacceptable.

This is definitely not the way to do business.

Yea totally agree... Not even a temp ban for the perpetrators to investigate anything, so they just continue their exploit...
As long as this is the attitude of MA (not giving a flying f.) I am gonna give EU break.

I disagree 100%. I don't think you appreciate the situation MA are in. By making an early public statement their options would become more limited. Whilst by not making any public statement they still leave themselves room to approach it from all angles i.e.

* Consult lawyers on the strength of the case of considering these people as harassment, exploiters, abusers etc. For example by flooding people with summon calls that could be considered as harassment but they would need to have legal strength of this checked first. It's wiser to check that that out first than make any rash comments. Similarly the fact that they rely on people making a mistake by clicking on accept (which can easily be done if you are hunting and clicking on middle of screen) could again be checked with their lawyers on the strength of this case for abuse. Since there are many considerations pros, and cons that need to be considered. Again no point in making any rash announcements.

* If it is deemed MA do have a strong legal case I'm pretty sure these people will be banned

* Also if no official announcement has been made they still have the option of talking/dealing with this unofficially behind the scenes. For example with the mothership that was once scammed whilst MA made no official announcement they did however handle it fairly well unofficially and the scammed ship was returned.

* etc



Essentially an official announcement in such situations can be counter productive. Whilst the method and stance adopted by MA may not be popular for the masses I do believe it's proper and right to handle the situation the best possible way they can even if that means the majority of the people will find it unpopular. At the end of the day it's not about popularity it's about doing the right thing.

Actually if they had made an early announcement it would be a sign MA have also gone down the bullshit route that a certain PP adopts i.e. tell the people what they want to hear regardless of whats right and wrong and call it communication skills. Whilst that may win you popularity it is totally abhorrent because it sacrifices justice in preference of cheap popularity points.

So interpreting silence for don't care is incorrect because it shows they care far more than you may realise...

 

[billairboy]

So and what are the benefits for this game to FORCE people in lootbale pvp zones huh?
This is legalized robbery with real money.

What kind of players do you want in here?
You already have enough leeches, cheaters etc... cause of the RCE. Enough said, i saw this coming as it was realesed.

The point and benefit with a lootable PVP is to make it more difficult to transport resources and stackable items from one planet to an other. This the help make it more easier for each planet to create their own economy and create more opportunities for new players to finder their place in the universe. It's also creates opportunities for those who like taking some risk to benefit from it, if you take the risk to trade between the planets you can find opportunities to earn some peds.

 

[cWal]

The point and benefit with a lootable PVP is to make it more difficult to transport resources and stackable items from one planet to an other. This the help make it more easier for each planet to create their own economy and create more opportunities for new players to finder their place in the universe. It's also creates opportunities for those who like taking some risk to benefit from it, if you take the risk to trade between the planets you can find opportunities to earn some peds.

OK but this was not the question. The question was : "So and what are the benefits for this game to FORCE people in lootbale pvp zones huh? This is legalized robbery with real money."
I totally agree, as there is a huge difference between going to play PVP knowing the risks and benefits, and being forced in and looted just because of a wrong clic !
I am very disappointed by how MA considers that peds are real money, but they do not consider stealing these peds as real stealing on the other side... That's why I have definitely stopped to deposit, with many other friends as well.
Apparently they haven't learned the lesson yet. Bad choice. I hope they will realize ASAP they are losing players because of only one misbehaving. Everyone is losing, excepted this moron. Do you think this is fair ?

 

[billairboy]

OK but this was not the question. The question was : "So and what are the benefits for this game to FORCE people in lootbale pvp zones huh? This is legalized robbery with real money."
I totally agree, as there is a huge difference between going to play PVP knowing the risks and benefits, and being forced in and looted just because of a wrong clic !
I am very disappointed by how MA considers that peds are real money, but they do not consider stealing these peds as real stealing on the other side... That's why I have definitely stopped to deposit, with many other friends as well.
Apparently they haven't learned the lesson yet. Bad choice. I hope they will realize ASAP they are losing players because of only one misbehaving. Everyone is losing, excepted this moron. Do you think this is fair ?

Okey, I thought you questioned the lootable pvp, not the this special issue. No, this is not fair and should be fixed. No one should be "kidnapped" into pvp against their will or it should not be this simple to do it by mistake.

 

[Drachenherz]

Okey, I thought you questioned the lootable pvp, not the this special issue. No, this is not fair and should be fixed. No one should be "kidnapped" into pvp against their will or it should not be this simple to do it by mistake.

Yes i question the FORCED lootable pvp at all. It is legalized robbery and there is no argument against it.
It is a crime in real life and it is one here. The only thing what makes this acceptable is that you have the CHOICE to go into this zones or not.
You can make special lootable pvp-zones in space with special mobs or mining from a ship like in calypso. You can make big events where Motherships and other crap have their use. You can limit a quads range...
There are thousends of possibilities to make this interesting and benefitting for the economy without forcing people into these zones.
And i bet if their was a vote under all active players you would have a huge majority refusing FORCED lootable pvp.

 

[Sunsout Gunsout]

THE ONLY REASON THEY MADE SPACE LOOTABLE IS BECAUSE IT IS THE ONLY WAY THEY CAN SKIM ADDITIONAL PROFIT FROM US WHILE MAKING US THINK ITS OUR FAULT. They know where we are in space, and they know what we are carrying. How come the only times my warp pilots have ever been shot at is when I am vip transporting thousands of ped of stacks??? In over 200 trips, the 3 times I have been shot at is are the 3 times I was carrying the largest amount of lootable stuff! (Never lost it tho, you slimy, scurvy pirate fucks)

When flying by myself, in the middle of nowhere, pirates come at me from tangential vectors like they knew I was there. I think they do. I think MA runs most of these pirate accounts, and I think THAT is how they skim more profits from us.

It is a great I idea, and I admire it. Steal from us and we blame ourselves, how simple could it be? And I have lived with it for years, because I never lost stacks of any consequence to a pirate by being smart...but this needs to come out now.

Because, NOW, you are letting people be robbed who did not intend to take that risk. And that is sickening. Ban these fucking accounts now, or my 2k USD/month depo is done. PERIOD!

Or wait, maybe these accounts are some of the ones you have.

Well, there goes my loot! Ready to fucking chip out anyway. I been pretty supportive for the last year or two (since my rage quit era a while back) but the fact that nothing has been done about pvp radar or these pirates, and space in general, is the last straw.

Someone said somewhere that if there was a vote, would space be lootable? Well, I think the vote would be 80% no. So, if MA is allowing something to exist that 80% of the clients despise, they ARE ONLY DOING SO BECAUSE THEY ARE PROFITING IN SOME WAY FROM IT. PERIOD. THERE IS NO OTHER EXPLANATION.

I understand pvp or space being lootable, and it being our choice whether or not to utilize it, but radar and summoning eliminate our choice, and the fairness, and it needs to be fixed. But it doesnt matter anymore. I and a lot of other people have lost faith completely now. This is the straw that broke the camels back.

All you had to do was temp ban them while you sorted out the issue. I and others asked you to do that days ago. You haven't, and now you will reap what you sow.

 

[Steve_saber]

I disagree 100%. I don't think you appreciate the situation MA are in. By making an early public statement their options would become more limited. Whilst by not making any public statement they still leave themselves room to approach it from all angles i.e.

* Consult lawyers on the strength of the case of considering these people as harassment, exploiters, abusers etc. For example by flooding people with summon calls that could be considered as harassment but they would need to have legal strength of this checked first. It's wiser to check that that out first than make any rash comments. Similarly the fact that they rely on people making a mistake by clicking on accept (which can easily be done if you are hunting and clicking on middle of screen) could again be checked with their lawyers on the strength of this case for abuse. Since there are many considerations pros, and cons that need to be considered. Again no point in making any rash announcements.

* If it is deemed MA do have a strong legal case I'm pretty sure these people will be banned

* Also if no official announcement has been made they still have the option of talking/dealing with this unofficially behind the scenes. For example with the mothership that was once scammed whilst MA made no official announcement they did however handle it fairly well unofficially and the scammed ship was returned.

* etc



Essentially an official announcement in such situations can be counter productive. Whilst the method and stance adopted by MA may not be popular for the masses I do believe it's proper and right to handle the situation the best possible way they can even if that means the majority of the people will find it unpopular. At the end of the day it's not about popularity it's about doing the right thing.

Actually if they had made an early announcement it would be a sign MA have also gone down the bullshit route that a certain PP adopts i.e. tell the people what they want to hear regardless of whats right and wrong and call it communication skills. Whilst that may win you popularity it is totally abhorrent because it sacrifices justice in preference of cheap popularity points.

So interpreting silence for don't care is incorrect because it shows they care far more than you may realise...

Sorry Ace, I think you give MA far too much credit.
MA ban who they want, when they want. They always have. They write the rule book we all agree to when we log in. I would guess the only problem they are having is, if they ban these bird brains for exploiting, how do they justify not giving people compensation??

 

[Vedder]

THE ONLY REASON THEY MADE SPACE LOOTABLE IS BECAUSE IT IS THE ONLY WAY THEY CAN SKIM ADDITIONAL PROFIT FROM US WHILE MAKING US THINK ITS OUR FAULT...

...Steal from us and we blame ourselves, how simple could it be? ...

...Or wait, maybe these accounts are some of the ones you have...

...they ARE ONLY DOING SO BECAUSE THEY ARE PROFITING IN SOME WAY FROM IT. PERIOD. THERE IS NO OTHER EXPLANATION...

Well yes, they plan to profit from Space, because they believe it makes Entropia a better game.

And please take your pills now. And take off that silly tin foil hat.


EDIT: Oops... Off topic I suppose.

 

[starcollector]

Each action has a reaction ....What reaction will have the playerbase after this "pirate trick"?

 

[SoReal]

I'm bit confused, I am not on windys FL but was added to the GL?

whatever.. it sucks ass in every way. Its an omni-shambles.

you dont have to be on his FL , all he has to do is open his guest list window spot health bars (at Twin or icarus maybe )and then drag the little stick man into his guest list.

you will not know if your on the GL unless you spot the message in the chat box which says "you have been added to guest list" . You can also not remove yourself from guest list unless you are on the actual ship that the guest list is for.

 

[Dab]

Each action has a reaction ....What reaction will have the playerbase after this "pirate trick"?

What will happen? The same thing that always happens.

Something similar to this. (Parody)

http://www.theonion.com/articles/facebook-we-will-make-our-product-worse-you-will-b,33074/

 

[DiabloP]

hello,

my wife was standing at auction at calypso when she suddenly saw message "you are being added to the guestlist of privateer by windy"

windy is not on her fl nor did she ever accept or requested to be added to the guestlist

i know windy is an known pirate so i told her to clean inventory and made supportcase,since i was sure an summon was on the way,
and surely she just got the summonmessage

this is an dirty trick by an pirate abusing the summonsystem,please if he did that to more players,also make an supportcase to get him banned,since financial repercussions is the only thing that will work for these guys

ma need to either punish them hard,or make it possible to remove 1 self from an guestlist

Hmmm . . . banning another player for using game mechanics in a way that was not obvious at first?

I though this game was supposed to be a sandbox

 

[Wollongong]

I disagree 100%. (...)

You raise good points in your post. However, there has not even been any real confirmation to the public that MA is examining the situation, which really isn't good to restore confidence. What hurt would it do if they came public saying: "We are aware of the situation, and this is indeed not how we intended the summoning to be used. We are currently examining the cases and will come to a decision soon" (or something like that).

 

[jenny ferr]

you will not know if your on the GL unless you spot the message in the chat box which says "you have been added to guest list" .

Not True, open your space map and click the icon "view homes" and you see all the ships you are on the gl for

Edit: and hover your mouse over the little H to see the name of the vessel and look for: XXXII

Edit2: can also open up the locations list and see all ships you are on GL for, little arrow on the left border of the map UI where TPs are listed usually

The vessels in my list is NOT I repeat is NOT involved in anyway​

 

[trance]

Each action has a reaction ....What reaction will have the playerbase after this "pirate trick"?

The reaction will be, that we lost more player in game, or that a lot stop to depo. The reaction will be also, that MA and EU gets more negative promotion all around, with the fact that less ppl will join this game.

that's why i put in this pic :


It say all about MA. Since a while they act like the pic imagine.

 

[Wollongong]

Sorry Ace, I think you give MA far too much credit.
MA ban who they want, when they want. They always have. They write the rule book we all agree to when we log in. I would guess the only problem they are having is, if they ban these bird brains for exploiting, how do they justify not giving people compensation??

Well, that is simple: you do punish the perps, but you also do not compensate, to avoid people taking too much risk because MA will bail them out anyway.

 

[Shapememory]

the best thing EVER would be if mindark ASKED their customers if they want the god damn space to be lootable.

i dont get it why mindark are so hellbent on making players steal from eachothers... and then even promote it.. it's sickening.

this also brings out the worst in some people.... from what i have Heard and seen some guys were actually really nice and helpfull untill mindark showed up and filled their hearts with greed and gave them the Tools to be evil and encouraged them to be so...

i don't care how hard mindark tries to legalize theft, theft will Always be theft

this bears repeating..


How long have we asked that the damn summon be moved from the middle of our screen? and such a simple thing is refused

it is so typical of MA to allow individuals no choice on if they are added to a guest list , its as if they want the system to be abused

also they named all the privateers with very similar names so its very easy to misread the name of the ship doing the summons. This was just laziness on MA part

 

[Sunsout Gunsout]

Well yes, they plan to profit from Space, because they believe it makes Entropia a better game.

And please take your pills now. And take off that silly tin foil hat.


EDIT: Oops... Off topic I suppose.

Lol don't quote only the half-hearted conjecture and dismiss someone as crazy, while editing out the rest. That's what kids do. They only listen to the part that supports their opinion.

Yeah I sure as hell may be wrong about some of the parts you quoted, but a lot of points are valid, and tbh, I don't give a fuck if 99% of conspiracy theories are wrong. The 1% that prove to be right are worth the ridicule that people get for thinking beyond the obvious.

 

[billairboy]

Yes i question the FORCED lootable pvp at all. It is legalized robbery and there is no argument against it.
It is a crime in real life and it is one here. The only thing what makes this acceptable is that you have the CHOICE to go into this zones or not.
You can make special lootable pvp-zones in space with special mobs or mining from a ship like in calypso. You can make big events where Motherships and other crap have their use. You can limit a quads range...
There are thousends of possibilities to make this interesting and benefitting for the economy without forcing people into these zones.
And i bet if their was a vote under all active players you would have a huge majority refusing FORCED lootable pvp.

If you don't have all of the space lootable pvp, the whole point is lost, because we in that case would be able to travel between the planets without risk. Yes, many would probably vote the space would be none lootable pvp, because they don't understand the long term benefits that MA want to achieve with this. I believe all of the planet partners more or less also agree with MA on this.

 

[DaisyColdFinger]

the best thing EVER would be if mindark ASKED their customers if they want the god damn space to be lootable.

i dont get it why mindark are so hellbent on making players steal from eachothers... and then even promote it.. it's sickening.

this also brings out the worst in some people.... from what i have Heard and seen some guys were actually really nice and helpfull untill mindark showed up and filled their hearts with greed and gave them the Tools to be evil and encouraged them to be so...

i don't care how hard mindark tries to legalize theft, theft will Always be theft

You are looking at this "problem" the wrong way!

A common byproduct of "risk", especially in communities facing a undesirable definite obstacle, is unity, etc, all the good stuff.

Here is another little factoid for you......

On average, you are more likely to get looted by MA than by Pirates !!!!

You want to disagree ?