do tantillions are good to train agility?

[humanwoman]

I am in a hurry

are tantillions still good to train agility? that's how it was supposed to sound

 

[Immortal]

they train it about 1% the rate of actually hunting. With ANYTHING (even melee)

So why would you bother?

 

[humanwoman]

what are the best mobs then?

 

[Immortal]

Just hunt. Like. Atrox. omg

 

[Wody]

tantillions were good because many people just stood still and autoclick-fapped while getting hit by them. Such behaviour has been fixed because after a while of standing still and getting hit, you don't get any skills anymore.

 

[Oleg]

Hunting Tantillions is good for all hunting skills.

Running around just getting hit and/or fapping in the middle of them is not good for much

 

[Doer]

There's currently not a spawn that's even a mere shade of the glory of the plateau, so don't bother.

Jaded opinion: next time there's a decent tant spawn will be on a taxed LA.

Edit: might as well qualify the assumptions of OP. The thing that gained tants their reputation as a great skilling mob for low cost was:

1. Low hp == lots of kill bonus
2. Low damage == can inexpensively tank many of them
3. A good, free, low maturity spawn

Agility is gained both from using firearms or some melee, and from evading, so hunting tants in crowded conditions could gain agility fairly quickly. You can probably achieve the same or faster gains by going to CP and blasting aliens with a big gun, but obviously that's a whole different level of play. I'd sometimes joke that tants are "poor man's CP".

Merp are available in decent spawns (but only on taxed LAs) and should have the same result. Merp young hp = tant young hp; damage ~ same.

 

[remontoire]

I am in a hurry

are tantillions still good to train agility? that's how it was supposed to sound

In my experience (and I'm a noob, so take this with appropriate amount of salt), you get more of it if you are being hit on by toughter mobs. As in - very little from a mob of Merp young compared to say hunting Feffoids. With the pre-armor hit size mattering, not post-armor.

Have I done a definite test? No I haven't.

 

[kalanen]

kill bonus

Just out of curiosity...

In my mind the word "bonus" doesn't fit in EU. It's pinball talk.

What is it? Multiple green around times of final blow? I mean have anyone ever bothered to keep an eye how much the value of single green line varies?

Number of green lines (most propably) has nothing to do with the value actually gained. Just the same value divided between more skills.

 

[Doer]

Just out of curiosity...

In my mind the word "bonus" doesn't fit in EU. It's pinball talk.

Have you not heard the crit hit sound?

What is it? Multiple green around times of final blow? I mean have anyone ever bothered to keep an eye how much the value of single green line varies?

Number of green lines (most propably) has nothing to do with the value actually gained. Just the same value divided between more skills.

Yes, it's visible in the sometimes 5-6 skill messages awarded when a mob dies.

You can call it what you want. In any case, it's a widely-accepted phenomenon among those that test skillgain. See e.g. Hijacker's launcher tests (on EF) or my hunting log (not on EF ).

 

[kalanen]

widely-accepted

There it is!

There's lots of widely-accepted thingies around: loot pool, randomness, fixed return, my urge to pee (brb), etc.

Sure i've noticed these green line rushes, but:

Other widely-accepted phenomenon is that big mob equals bigger gains per green line.

So, in case occurence of "kill bonus" is random against propability (like 10% chance), size of mob doesn't count. 1000 killed falx should give same amount of "kill bonuses" than 1000 daikibas, right?

In case it's fixed, like every Nth mob gives it, the num of "bonuses" is the same.

If you make these greenies relative to hp/touhness, claiming that small mobs give better skills than big ones is kinda weird IMO.

This is not widely-accepted fact, but a fact: If you have naturally skilled yourself to some high proff standing and chip one corresponding skill of that proffession for zero, you keep getting a lot of green lines of eg. skill.

Why?

Have you not heard the crit hit sound?

ARGH!!! HATES!!!

 

[Immortal]

See e.g. Hijacker's launcher tests (on EF) or my hunting log (not on EF ).

If I ever bother with the merp/molis/ other rubbish mob challenge, I might look at skill gains to verfiy this statement. For all that's known, it only occurs because the launcher does damage to multiple enemies per hit

 

[Oleg]

If I ever bother with the merp/molis/ other rubbish mob challenge, I might look at skill gains to verfiy this statement. For all that's known, it only occurs because the launcher does damage to multiple enemies per hit

Do 500 PED on Merps or Tants and 500 PED on Atrox with the same weapon, check your attack-only skills and you'll see the difference quite clearly.

Kill bonus is not a myth

 

[Dollymaus]

i gained like 1 ped evade per 40 K Ammo spended with big Launchers at small merps and 30-40 around me...never got more anywhere (except 3X skill event doing the same *g*)

 

[Naithen]

Buy a mod merc on your credit card then see how your agility improves when you run for your life away from the wife

 

[sungam]

Buy a mod merc on your credit card then see how your agility improves when you run for your life away from the wife

too funny

 

[Doer]

There it is!

blah blah

That's why i qualified it as "among those who test skillgain". The idea that high evade reduces the damage done per hit is probably widely accepted among the playerbase, but those who have tested it don't widely accept it. A widely accepted theory in science isn't guaranteed to be true but it's got a better chance than a widely accepted notion in the astrology camp where there's no objective assessment. The point is that knowledge advances as certain shared understanding is built up over time based on repeated observations. Without that, there's no progress. I was merely asserting that kill bonus has achieved membership in that accepted shared understanding for those who investigate such things due to overwhelming evidence, not that it's blindly accepted due to tradition.

 

[kalanen]

That'yoddlidoodly

Did you read the blabla part?

How tt value of skillgain in 5 lines can be considered as bonus compared to same tt value in one line?

Yes, it can't be measured accurately. I can keep myself in peds by hunting uneco, but if I'd start shooting straigth "gathering data", I would lose since that wouldn't be hunting. It would be shooting and writing numbers. (Who was that physics dude who said something like observing small shiteparticles twistes the results? Planc?)

Let's assume something that's actually pretty safe assumption: System operates in TT and it doesn't give free TT value to playerbase. Skills are measured in TT, so system doesn't give skills for free. Doesn't that mean TT value of skills are reduced from something, like loot? Part of interaction is paid as skill TT and the rest as loot. And if the amount paid as skills is determined by the skills you already have (example in the end of my blabla post), you have made it chaotic enough to call it random.

Damn. I still didn't make my point clear.

I'll get me coat.

 

[dotc0m]

I did use tantillon hunting to level up all the obcsure profession like : explosive, fisting, longblade, shortblade, etc up to 2000point and more in each skills. I even managed to hit martial arts starting from 0 just with tantillons.

that mob had no regen, low hp, etc, so it was easy to come by and kill using all the noob (L) weapon that doesnt work on any other mob anymore because of their regen and then go up the SIB chart on those differents skills.

atm there no really mob that can help u achieve this that fast.

yes you can do it on drone, argo, faucevix, molisk, snable, combibo etc... but nothing was as fast as tantillon used to be in term of skills-gain-spawn-ratio-hp-sized-no-regen-mob

theses day the only thing that can get that close, and i think its kinda pretty close to it infact, is MERP. now there a LA full of it, and its almost as good as tantillon but i didnt test it

BTW, im not trying to argue with anyone, just telling my experience, and i like that atleast now there a clone of tantillon available in a LA to help ppl get a use of all the bogus (L) weapons that have no other use.

I also know that DOER been a very big hunter of tantillons isnt? and i know he tested alot of things ingame so i wouldnt bother to argue against him because he surely close to being right, the "surely" mean that anytime he share is opinions there a chance MA change it because its been "shared" to others lol

 

[Doer]

Did you read the blabla part?

How tt value of skillgain in 5 lines can be considered as bonus compared to same tt value in one line?

Yeah i did and sorry if i sounded flippant--i'm just surprised you aren't aware of this already. Anyway, like i said, the green spam on killing the mob is just a symptom; i don't even really pay attention to those, but do get satisfaction when a "skill hof" comes up now and then that fills the chat with green lines.

The point is that you can measure your skill gain over a hunt, normalize by damage done or PED output, and see a clear difference. What it boils down to is grinding small merp (since that's the most recent example) i get a bit more than 1/2 the volume of skill per hour compared to hunting sumima or drones, but several times the volume per PED output. So, it's slower but much less expensive (ignoring markup drops in loot etc.). I actually have higher weapon economy on bigger mobs so it's not an issue of "hunting eco" in that sense, it's actually a more efficient skillgain per PED expenditure due to the predominating kill bonus effect.

Obviously the time cost has to be factored in for people to decide what's "good" for them.

 

[Jimmy B]

kill bonus

Just out of curiosity...

In my mind the word "bonus" doesn't fit in EU. It's pinball talk.

What is it? Multiple green around times of final blow? I mean have anyone ever bothered to keep an eye how much the value of single green line varies?

Number of green lines (most propably) has nothing to do with the value actually gained. Just the same value divided between more skills.

Kill bonus is a term even MA officials have used here I think.

I tested it once during triple skill on melee stuff I had low skills in. So each skill gain produced enough gain to be read off the skills page. I can probably dig up a post from back then with the exact details but the results were something like:

Normal hits: skill gains per green line were between 0.5 and 1.0
Kill hits: skill gains per green line were between 1.5 and 3.0

As I skilled up the gains per line obviously reduced but the contrast between normal and kill hits remained clear.