How big of a ped cycle is needed before you would typically see ~95% Returns stated by MA.

AckerZ

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Having a real bad time of it lately with hunting, must have cycled around 3,000Ped before recycling shrapnel and my returns are really low around 70-80% TT. Should I be cycling much more ped than this to really start to see those reported ~95% TT returns that MA report?

For the more seasoned hunter how much ped are you cycling in a month before you start to see acceptable TT returns?
 

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Not that I'm a professional or anything, but from what I have be reading and researching, it's not the ped cycle. It's how many mobs you kill. About 10k or 20k kills is when you should see the 95% return. It's true from my first hunting log. I been grinding on Berycled youngs for over 10k ped. That's a lot of Berycled youngs killed. My average return eventually evened out to 96% at the end. Current log on Exarosaur is above 100% haha. I think it's just a lucky start. I suspect it will go down to that 95% after 10k ped cycle. That's also a lot of kills on exarosaurs. Just keep grinding, your return should even out soon. You might be getting a big global soon. Just make sure you have the bankroll to keep killing. This is why I stay on low level mobs like Berycled and exarosaurs and using tt weapons haha.
 

Tom Archy Blad

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A returns around 70-80% after cycling 3,000ped seems pretty low especially if you hunt low HP mob (I would say <400/500hp). Maybe something goes wrong here.

A majority of my run (1.5k ped, 500/600 kills) are close to 95%, often a litlle under like 92-94% and then i make a good run over 110/120% pushing my average at ~96%
Stats done over 200k cycled in 7 month on 500/1200hp mobs
 

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Bad returns can have different reasons, non-maxed SiB weapons can be a waste, high MU outfit or simply allways doing the same things.
I do not think it is related to the number of mobs killed, else those hunting Chirpies owuld have their average at a lot faster pace than those hunting Leviathans.
It's all about averages. On average I get 5 globals per gun cycling roughly 15k. I have guns I get 0-1 globals and I have guns where I get 20.
MY average return varies greatly, could be that thos 0 global runs give me more minis to profit and the 20 global ones do not help at all. no magic number like kil x mobs and all is fine or cycle xK PED and you are in the green, at least not since Loot2.0 .
The chance to get multipliers which get you faster in the average area with more mobs killed , because of more loot events, might be true.
But from my experience, if I do the same thing over and over again it evens out some day.
Maybe not as fast as I wanted, but the higher the level one must cycle way more to get there and killing a gazillion of Chirpys will not give you that magic ATH :D
All about patience.
And trading smart to cut the losses.
And not forgetting that gaining skills is also "loot"...just because your PEDs go down does not mean you have not got the "average" compensated in skills
 

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A returns around 70-80% after cycling 3,000ped seems pretty low especially if you hunt low HP mob (I would say <400/500hp). Maybe something goes wrong here.

A majority of my run (1.5k ped, 500/600 kills) are close to 95%, often a litlle under like 92-94% and then i make a good run over 110/120% pushing my average at ~96%
Stats done over 200k cycled in 7 month on 500/1200hp mobs
Like the one above you looks like having decent return, i just came back november 11th and close to 93% TT return on 18 hours hunting.
Next 18-20 hours currently close to 94%.

Both of you must have 70 looter or something right ?
 

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Bad returns can have different reasons, non-maxed SiB weapons can be a waste, high MU outfit or simply allways doing the same things.
I do not think it is related to the number of mobs killed, else those hunting Chirpies owuld have their average at a lot faster pace than those hunting Leviathans.
It's all about averages. On average I get 5 globals per gun cycling roughly 15k. I have guns I get 0-1 globals and I have guns where I get 20.
MY average return varies greatly, could be that thos 0 global runs give me more minis to profit and the 20 global ones do not help at all. no magic number like kil x mobs and all is fine or cycle xK PED and you are in the green, at least not since Loot2.0 .
The chance to get multipliers which get you faster in the average area with more mobs killed , because of more loot events, might be true.
But from my experience, if I do the same thing over and over again it evens out some day.
Maybe not as fast as I wanted, but the higher the level one must cycle way more to get there and killing a gazillion of Chirpys will not give you that magic ATH :D
All about patience.
And trading smart to cut the losses.
And not forgetting that gaining skills is also "loot"...just because your PEDs go down does not mean you have not got the "average" compensated in skills
Interesting viewpoint. I feel like with chirpy, it's hard because they have such low HP that there would be a lot of wasted ped on over kills. I believe if you have a 0.5 to 1 dmg weapon, you can also get that magic 95% tt return number on chirpy. I think iirc from the MA Charlie's posts he say overkill are only compensated in loot to a certain extent. So we should still avoid overkills.

Off topic: skill gains. Does anyone else get the feeling that skills are over valued at the moment. I say this because ESI are rare loot, which means people cannot chip out as they want. We can only chip out if there are esi available. I can imagine if esi is available in the TT, then skills would become a lot cheaper.
 

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Interesting viewpoint. I feel like with chirpy, it's hard because they have such low HP that there would be a lot of wasted ped on over kills. I believe if you have a 0.5 to 1 dmg weapon, you can also get that magic 95% tt return number on chirpy. I think iirc from the MA Charlie's posts he say overkill are only compensated in loot to a certain extent. So we should still avoid overkills.

Off topic: skill gains. Does anyone else get the feeling that skills are over valued at the moment. I say this because ESI are rare loot, which means people cannot chip out as they want. We can only chip out if there are esi available. I can imagine if esi is available in the TT, then skills would become a lot cheaper.
Even a Chirpy Young has 10 HP, no need for a 0.5 dmg Weapon :D And even if you get a critical that is counted towards efficiency and not overkilling.
Skillgains are way overlooked, AFAIK it is still based on decay and since the codex, also on the latter one. From my experience, getting anythign above 20 PED TT in skills yanked my returns greatly..enough to to take a holiday on a codex free planet and have a more consitent return.
And then there is also something like "skill equilibrium"...sometimes it seems that the skills need to be in a "balance"....had it often that chipping in evader would yank my returns for months. Then all the sudden it was normal again...not really like those bad cycles, but when my other skills had catched up to be according to that evader level.

As for ESIs beeing rare...haven't looted one in 2 years but since there are still skills traded on auction and from the MU they can not be that rare.
I would assume that one needs quite a high looter level (not my measely 50) and high efficiency (not the 70 I have) to get one once in a while.
 

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~95% TT returns that MA report?
Worst decisions are usually taken when you have wrong assumptions about partial information given or misunderstood.Expecting similar outcome when you don't have information about other's input and maybe yours leads to even more misunderstanding and eventually disappointment and discouragement.
I advise reading every single piece of official note 100 times each and forget what you heard from any player.
 
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Worst decisions are usually taken when you have wrong assumptions about partial information given or misunderstood.Expecting similar outcome when you don't have information about other's input and maybe yours leads to even more misunderstanding and eventually disappointment and discouragement.
I advise reading every single piece of official note 100 times each and forget what you heard from any player.
Messi you're right only about the disappointment. I read the developer notes 100 times, I have this return 96%, sometimes I looted ESI and other high MU items... and this game continues to be shit, because the balance for the last time is more than-35K. Don't talk about cycles and efficiency, it doesn't work. MA are simple businessmen and they need people like you and me. People like me pay, people like you ... you know. You were a legend to me, and I believed that my perseverance would also be rewarded, but MA has a different opinion. Now Yes, it's just the frustration of wasting time and money.
 

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Worst decisions are usually taken when you have wrong assumptions about partial information given or misunderstood.Expecting similar outcome when you don't have information about other's input and maybe yours leads to even more misunderstanding and eventually disappointment and discouragement.
I advise reading every single piece of official note 100 times each and forget what you heard from any player.

! This claim about knowing how Entropia works is disputed
 

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Worst decisions are usually taken when you have wrong assumptions about partial information given or misunderstood.Expecting similar outcome when you don't have information about other's input and maybe yours leads to even more misunderstanding and eventually disappointment and discouragement.
I advise reading every single piece of official note 100 times each and forget what you heard from any player.

I'm sorry for you that you need to read something 100 times to understand it... really...
But just to let you know, a lot of people are able to fully understand the meaning of a text the first time they read it.

You should get off your pedestal before you fall off it, it is less painful...

And as you advise it, people should indeed forget what they hear from other players, starting with what they hear from you...
 

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I'm sorry for you that you need to read something 100 times to understand it... really...
But just to let you know, a lot of people are able to fully understand the meaning of a text the first time they read it.

You should get off your pedestal before you fall off it, it is less painful...

And as you advise it, people should indeed forget what they hear from other players, starting with what they hear from you...
I actually spent a lot of time reading word by word every single piece of official information over the last 8 years or so.You don't have to be bright or dumb to understand it, you just have to pay attention and read it carefully and understand it.
My observation since loot 2.0 is that over 85% of player base doesn't read dev notes and those 15% who read it 99% of them misinterpret what Mindark stated.
I advise people to read and find their way.
 

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I can't imagine player like you with good gears and high skills level, still getting 70%-80% TT return.
I only using weapon from daily token, with 60%-80% TT return.
 

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Having a real bad time of it lately with hunting, must have cycled around 3,000Ped before recycling shrapnel and my returns are really low around 70-80% TT. Should I be cycling much more ped than this to really start to see those reported ~95% TT returns that MA report?

For the more seasoned hunter how much ped are you cycling in a month before you start to see acceptable TT returns?
This may not be applicable to you, but since it was the reason for my very similar 70-80% returns on my first tracker I will mention it. I was converting shrapnel mid-hunt and not properly accounting for that in my cycle/return calculations. Once I made the adjustments in my tracker, my numbers started looking "right." If this sounds like it could apply to you, I'd be glad to discuss it further.
 

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Having a real bad time of it lately with hunting, must have cycled around 3,000Ped before recycling shrapnel and my returns are really low around 70-80% TT. Should I be cycling much more ped than this to really start to see those reported ~95% TT returns that MA report?

For the more seasoned hunter how much ped are you cycling in a month before you start to see acceptable TT returns?
I think they stated 97%.
 

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I actually spent a lot of time reading word by word every single piece of official information over the last 8 years or so.You don't have to be bright or dumb to understand it, you just have to pay attention and read it carefully and understand it.
My observation since loot 2.0 is that over 85% of player base doesn't read dev notes and those 15% who read it 99% of them misinterpret what Mindark stated.
I advise people to read and find their way.
Did you check the guy global list?
A lot of players a year old still accepting efficiency like "more efficiency will increase my average damage" =D.. you tells for few weeks guy to read MA notes. I dont tells that is wrong, but sound like a lawyer to say "this is written in the law, just read the laws"... ie. everyone need practice to understand what MA tell us... and also there has no notes about the return in last 6 months, but we know there has changes. If the point 6 months ago was to hunt long time for good %, now the things are for short. If we hunt now long time the system fuk us totally..and all new players trying to complete a mission of thousands mobs, totally s*x. And these changes are not in the notes my friend.

To OP..
1st.. Noone will tells you the truth publicy by two reasons.. there has alot old players which dont understand why some players are 250+ lvl with half of their time in game.. and the secound is simple, if this 200+ tells you how to make return of 99% publicy, everyone will start to do the same... ie. thats not good for MA even for the economy. Thats why you dont have answers which you looking for.

There is simple example from wich you can start to learn the hunting..

Looks you are in Arkadia, so buy a TT Rifle and go kill 100 Young Zaduls.. only youngs, becouse they are ~100 HP with their HP regen.
*Cost to kill.. how much you will spend for this hunt run is the point of this. *Leave the loot return for the test, every time will be different.
After you do this save your data..
Go kill 10 HP Caraboks.. again 100 of them. But multilyplay their cost to kill by 10 to be equal with Zaduls hunt.

So the first anwer you looking for is this difference. The next answer is defensive skill and healing tools. For biger mobs you need better skills otherwise you pay more. Many players will tell you that the decay enter in the calculation, and they will be right, but that dont change the fact that you will spend more for kill.
Arkadia is good place to start learning the game becouse for the low mobs you will no need armor and heal and with their result some players learing another just shoot them.

Test the game in long duration not only in few hunts. The example above is for 100 mobs, so how much you will kills this week.. month. And like you see the noobs beleave that when they have alot loss they will hit some big after a time. And again they will be right.. but when, when you have 5k loss you will hit 1k or 2k.. or 5k? Ask them when.

Check the Mess* globals and equal them with yours. He kill 2-3k HP mobs while your mobs are 400 HP.. but the globals looks similar.. so looks you should be more rich than him =)

A week ago i test my defensive skills on 100 Atrox the result is 15 pec.. if you make this test, check your armor decay and healing tool.. but dont mess the things. The example above is only for cost to kill.

1st mistake is Dynamic rate.. everyone know about it, but no one use it in their calculation. 0.95% .. 0.89%.. 0.80%.. 0.85%.. 110%. Depends of your playtime you can be lucky or not today.. so.
2nd mistake is the mob loot that noob choosing. You got lucky with Arkadia, but unlucky for underground there. Mostly noob players buying very expensive amp A101, the price now is above 300ped, and they gona to hunt Kerberos.. i.e. Kerb loot MU is similar as shrapnels, you no need more efficiency for 101% MU loot! So the Mobs choise is very important after you know how to decrease your cost to kill.
3rd Hunting mobs which are not so popular mostly means more loss if you dont have practice. Therefore is your problem i guess. If you hunt mobs while others do, be sure your % will be much better.

The compilation of success in game include many things, dont be afraid to test the different weapons attachments even to oneshoot mobs. You cant found the ballance if you dont know which one is good and bad.

My advice is keep on focus only one diapason of mobs HP for the next months, depends of your wallet and dont jump above, compare with your own old hunts, while you start to make profit, then try to find better.

Good luck!
 

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Messi you're right only about the disappointment. I read the developer notes 100 times, I have this return 96%, sometimes I looted ESI and other high MU items... and this game continues to be shit, because the balance for the last time is more than-35K. Don't talk about cycles and efficiency, it doesn't work. MA are simple businessmen and they need people like you and me. People like me pay, people like you ... you know. You were a legend to me, and I believed that my perseverance would also be rewarded, but MA has a different opinion. Now Yes, it's just the frustration of wasting time and money.

How did you figure out efficiency doesn't work ?
 

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Having a real bad time of it lately with hunting, must have cycled around 3,000Ped before recycling shrapnel and my returns are really low around 70-80% TT. Should I be cycling much more ped than this to really start to see those reported ~95% TT returns that MA report?

For the more seasoned hunter how much ped are you cycling in a month before you start to see acceptable TT returns?
Cycles in the game are much bigger than 30 days. Can be 6months+
Properly tracking returns should just boost the morale up a bit but that's it. Make sure you track correctly and it should never fall below 94% over 50k peds or so.
Main focus should be MU while continuing to improve skills and gear. Don't fight the %tt return war, it's a lost cause.
 

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1st.. Noone will tells you the truth publicy by two reasons.. there has alot old players which dont understand why some players are 250+ lvl with half of their time in game.. and the secound is simple, if this 200+ tells you how to make return of 99% publicy, everyone will start to do the same... ie. thats not good for MA even for the economy. Thats why you dont have answers which you looking for.
This is very true.

OP, I have something to tell you, and pls note that this is just my opinion, this is how I play. When you see that things aren't going your way, when you get a multiplier like every 17th mob or so, or when your hitrate in mining is about 20% planetside, just stop, stop, don't push it, do something else instead, try another mob, another mining area, maybe some crafting, look for whatever works for you. Some days loot is so bad nothing works, at this time you need to decrease your turnover to a minimum or just take a brake. In my opinion, you don't need high efficiency to be efficient, unless you plan to grind the same mob 16 hours a day for the rest of your life, just play smart and it'll make you efficient. Yes, some people say that when the loot is very bad, it means there's a huge multiplier coming... this doesn't work 99.9% of the time.

And guys, honestly, this is part of what I was talking in my thread about leeches. Hunting is the most popular profession by far, and you have hunters like this with 70-80% returns on the one hand, on the other - bunch of parasitic leeches with ZERO TURNOVER, who do absolutely nothing but tax every other participant in the economy by withdrawing their PEDs out of the pool that we create. How long is this model going to go on, given recent developments in the gaming industry? Is it possible that one day we will have more resellers in this game than hunters, miners and crafters? If so, what would be the consequences of this?
 

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OP, I have something to tell you, and pls note that this is just my opinion, this is how I play. When you see that things aren't going your way, when you get a multiplier like every 17th mob or so, or when your hitrate in mining is about 20% planetside, just stop, stop, don't push it, do something else instead, try another mob, another mining area, maybe some crafting, look for whatever works for you. Some days loot is so bad nothing works, at this time you need to decrease your turnover to a minimum or just take a brake. In my opinion, you don't need high efficiency to be efficient, unless you plan to grind the same mob 16 hours a day for the rest of your life, just play smart and it'll make you efficient. Yes, some people say that when the loot is very bad, it means there's a huge multiplier coming... this doesn't work 99.9% of the time.
This is one of the most popular advices in the game and the worst one at the same time.
TT return is a result of a formula that takes into account your 1.weapon setup efficiency, 2. looter levels and 3. number of looting events. The best advice I got from a good friend of mine: you don't stop hunting a MU mob because the loot is bad. Period.
 
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How did you figure out efficiency doesn't work ?
By the fact that I get 96% with a crappy weapon and looter 41 LVL. And if the myth about highend weapons was true, then with high efficiency and high level of looters, players would get more than 100% return. Which MA can't allow.. or can it? I know one player with such equipment and skills but they won't tell you about their return
 

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By the fact that I get 96% with a crappy weapon and looter 41 LVL. And if the myth about highend weapons was true, then with high efficiency and high level of looters, players would get more than 100% return. Which MA can't allow.. or can it? I know one player with such equipment and skills but they won't tell you about their return
Not MA eat the peds, the mobs do it.

If you got 96% always that means always someone else around you got bigger loss.. so that is also and the answer of above 100%.

I testing to play only by TT year ago, taking the gameplay from our RU friends, and is posible if you know about time cyrcles.

The problem is the time vs few peds daily.. sometime bit more. For me this gameplay dont worth, but for many others work fine.

You took the pool from others.. not from MA. The mobs are just tool for this and everyone accept to loss peds with the first shoot.

Go shoot 5h today somewhere away from others and share your result pls.
 

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By the fact that I get 96% with a crappy weapon and looter 41 LVL. And if the myth about highend weapons was true, then with high efficiency and high level of looters, players would get more than 100% return. Which MA can't allow.. or can it? I know one player with such equipment and skills but they won't tell you about their return
96% in how much turnover ?
 

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Not MA eat the peds, the mobs do it.

If you got 96% always that means always someone else around you got bigger loss.. so that is also and the answer of above 100%.

I testing to play only by TT year ago, taking the gameplay from our RU friends, and is posible if you know about time cyrcles.

The problem is the time vs few peds daily.. sometime bit more. For me this gameplay dont worth, but for many others work fine.

You took the pool from others.. not from MA. The mobs are just tool for this and everyone accept to loss peds with the first shoot.

Go shoot 5h today somewhere away from others and share your result pls.
This could have been the case before loot 2.0 but it's false today,
 

Deemer

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This could have been the case before loot 2.0 but it's false today,
Please check the OP stats in EL. You guys forgot some things... there is path to walk from 100 HP mob to 2k mob.

In this road ingame inactive players are much more than active, their hunt means 200 mobs daily. And their goal is the pool only.

In the case every noob dont understand about weapon range; how crits work and so on, the pool grows much more than you think and many players just use this.

New player have no idea when to hun and when to stop, so we don't talk for 3k HP mobs, and the guy have 3k of ped cyrcled.

All this injustice is caused by the MA to push players for a higher level and plank, but not everyone can buy a 20k weapon at level 10, especially if they do not understand the game. So yes it is possible to play on loot 2.0 above 100%, i dont have experiance in old loot version.
 

ImUp2Mischief

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Having a real bad time of it lately with hunting, must have cycled around 3,000Ped before recycling shrapnel and my returns are really low around 70-80% TT. Should I be cycling much more ped than this to really start to see those reported ~95% TT returns that MA report?

For the more seasoned hunter how much ped are you cycling in a month before you start to see acceptable TT returns?

Every mayhem this happens, since mindark didnt restart servers since end it continues.

The probability of getting the smaller multipliers has been greatly reduced.

This is why all the big loots keep popping, short term losses are much greater.
 
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