Price of Skills, economic discussion (NO MOANING THREAD!)

[Sarubaboon]

I would like to have an intelligent discussion about the price of skills in game, i have observed for some time the price of some of my skills going down, now:

-I want to have a constructive discussion as to why this is happening
-Please, no moaning, complaining, etc on this thread, for that, go to other threads

What do you think the reason for this drop is? is it a cyclical/annual thing, like, prices drop before summer?. is it just merely reflecting the market value (i.e. skills were way too expensive before and they are merely heading towards their natural equilibrium value)? is it to do with the price of residue falling? (for example, related to engineering)

Please don't start saying things like people are leaving the game, the game is doomed, etc, i have heard the same thing many times for the last 3 years and it is always, well, crap. If you feel that way please just vote that way on the poll....

 

[thoreau]

I think that over time the price of skills should always drop. This is because the amount of skills in game is steadily increasing. I believe that the rate of skills increasing is greater than the increase of people buying skills.

I think in the recent past we have seen spikes in skill prices due to several factors. One was the land grab. Another was due to a player starting a skill shop and buying out a lot of skills and then reselling them in that shop at an increased price.

Of course if MA adds or changes a game mechanic then the price of skills will move accordingly.

 

[burnsey]

When skills were nerfed, those above the nerf level gained not only a huge advantage over the rest of the players but also a great monetary value as well. I would guess that skill prices get lower due to competition amongst them as well as everyone else, since their skills where gained relatively free compared to people who have to skill up manually to get a chip, they can sell them at market or lower and still be profitable.

 

[Indigo Wyrd]

I think the idea of buying skills is kind of goofy anyways. Sure, it means you can dump a lot of cash and have really high stats fast - to the point of there being very little challenge to much of anything.

The "game" part of Entropia - and really the Entropian Life Experience, is a matter of learning - both in and out of character. As players, we learn the mechanics of the game - how things work, which things work best, and what is the easiest way to do the things we enjoy.

Much like in real-life, if you were to start in a career, you would need first to acquire the skills necessary to perform well enough to move up the career ladder. And this simply takes time and experience. The same is true for our Calypsian Colonists - though they do have the option due to "advanced technology" to simply have this "experience" implanted, they miss out on much of the actual learning experience.

Now I'm not saying skills shouldn't be "sellable" - it doesn't bother me that they are - and if that's how someone wants to "play" then by all means, enjoy it. I however find the learning process to be what makes the "game" something to "play".

I, personally, will be very unlikely to buy skills so the price of skills is free to do whatever it wants. That's how I enjoy playing. I have something to look forward to "doing", and get a sense of accomplishment in doing so.

Otherwise, as the user-run economy goes - I would love to see an actual economist's analysis of it - I'm sure it would give someone fits. I'll skip the rant about it, but it doesn't take an advance degree to realize it's more than just a little out of whack overall.

Just my .02pc

~Indigo

 

[OnTarget]

My personal view (most likely a poor one)
Is that skills in general are heavily under valued and at the same point ESI's are over priced. I think the higher ESI prices get the lower actual skill prices will get.

 

[valentin]

Nowdays is cheaper to buy the skills or to get it natural because off MA:s nerf. on skills.

 

[jw350]

I was thinking that with all the changes that have gone on over the last few VU's, some are selling the skills they figure they can do with out to raise some peds.

 

[Trina Xenophage]

I think its simply because MA has nerfed skills and to get the same value per ped of skill you need to buy more to get to same results.

IE before you could buy 1k skill for XX.X ped and got YYY result..
Now to get same YYY result since MA nerf skill you need 1500 Skill to do same result.

People are just not paying same price for a skill that is worth less to their ends then before.

 

[Harvest]

When MA nerfed skills it gave all the old players a bunch of extra ped. To avoid having to pay the inflated prices of the skills to the players, MA manipulates the economy by make things unaffordable/unplayable. If a bunch of ppl leave at once it devalues their total withdrawl.

Skills are cheaper cause ppl are leaving and no one can afford over priced skills.

 

[Slaytin]

i think it could also be due to the fact that more people might've started using L items since newer items were dropped and skilling could be easier for some and faster which allows em to sell more through time and now is about the time when they start selling?

 

[Hubert Zymp]

The summer (cyclical) + major bugs (temporary) + lack of information (temporary).

Summer 2007 was sooo slow for trading. 2008 is headed just the same.

Good objects, or skills, have more or less a fixed price (say, if the underlying reasons for their price do not change). But fluctuations do occur.
For example, engineering is worth 9000-13000% as far as I am concerned.
Above 13000, I don't trade it.
Below 9000, if there is something I want to stock for a few months, I definetely buy. -The exception being right now, because how fast do you skill up on the X-XV bps? - That I don't know (if someone knows please post)

Also, currently, the unusual number of major bugs doesn't help build trust.
Feels like MA lost 1 or 2 good tech dudz.

However, MA's long term plans are just good enough for me.

Note : to strengthen (or re-establish, ie sink) the engineering market again as a whole (skills, bps...) posting information about the skillgains, and in general what do the X-XV bps do to skill gains would help a lot. I have quite some skills in mech engineering, but I can only go up to IX bps, and I think that the large majority of the traders/resellers can't craft much - so the lack of information is definetely a current penalty.

Thanks for bringing the discussion up, by the way.

 

[safara]

There is also the low availability or high %mu of the (L) weapons after the Korss400 sort of level.

So, many people see no incentive or requirement to skill past level 15 or so. And so sell the skills they get over that.

 

[overscore]

I tnink prices move according to how the game is right now. A combination of available (L) items, amount of new people wich seem to come in waves from what i've heard, rumours, recent changes in the game that made something really attractive, or the opposite. Resellers, high skilled players leaving or the opposite, low skilled rich players chipping up. In the end it all comes down to supply and demand :þ

 

[Etopia]

Not enought buy skill
To much player sell skill
Not enought skill loss
Skill amount keep go up
Price condanate to go down

For skill price to be at least same , or go up , we need a lot more new player than player that leave , and that far from the normal way of EU beeing...

 

[Norbert]

I think a lot of players hit a wall in all professions due to cost of higher equipment/weapons, and chip out extra skill not needed to max their current weapon or in the case of mining strip all out and start over. The mark ups and high tt value of higher equipment just shuts out a good amount of the playerbase from ever using them.
Also I believe the skill changes a few VU's back has added to this devaluation of skills, some higher skilled players have been selling out skills to make purchases in game due to being effectively given a large value of skills by the changes. The skill changes have also put many off from chipping upwards because of the insane tt value of filled esi you would now need to max out unlimited weapons and obtain higher unlocks.
I think it is a combination of the above, along with other things already mentioned, summer sell off etc .

 

[Xen]

With a few exceptions, the only skill prices I think are too low are crafting skills. Right now it's far less costly to chip up crafting skill than to skill it naturally.

I think a cause for much of the downturn was when metal residue was selling for a very high markup. You could skill and hardly lose anything, or profit. This resulted in a lot of crafting skilling. Then MA made a lot more metal residue drop, a lot of people stopped crafting, and sold their skills.

Also, as the prices dropped, I think a lot of people became worried about losing the value of their skills, so they sold (panic selling). This drove the prices down even more.

Engineering has been pushed down further by a lot of miners selling small chips, constantly undercutting each other, and driving the price down. I think engineering is a big bargain right now considering it contributes a high percentage to professional level in most crafting professions. I would not be surprised if resellers are stocking up on engineering chips at the current prices. It's really ridiculously low. BP comp is pretty low now also, considering how hard it is to skill naturally.