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Question: Punishing the Pattern Recognition of Players

Yet the topic is about your inability to follow a pattern as it appears to keep changing. Interesting

I accept that, yes I am an impulsive poster, when I find something interesting that I want to share, I share it. I am also trying to reach out to others and understand their perspectives. I just hope that they understand mine.

My opinion also grows over time, with new things that I discover, I add that to my knowledge.
 
R4tt3xx said:
I accept that, yes I am an impulsive poster, when I find something interesting that I want to share, I share it. I am also trying to reach out to others and understand their perspectives. I just hope that they understand mine.
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Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoy reading your points of view and how it is progressing. It has lead me to learn numerous new concepts, and I very much enjoy learning. I have yet to come across anything that I have been able to apply to my understanding of the game, but that may just as well be attributed to my stupidity for all I know.
 
I am going to go off topic but here is something interesting..

I have a sequence of numbers from 1 to m I also lets say have a forumla e^(m). I can convert that formula into a spiral x=cos(e^(m))*sqrt(m) y =-sin(e^(m))*sqrt(m)

heres a little red herring for you e^4= ?? Any miner will recognize the result. I think you see why I am so interested in testing these number systems against the game and seeing what they do..
 
Ferial said:
Don't get me wrong, I thoroughly enjoy reading your points of view and how it is progressing. It has lead me to learn numerous new concepts, and I very much enjoy learning. I have yet to come across anything that I have been able to apply to my understanding of the game, but that may just as well be attributed to my stupidity for all I know.
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Likewise, I feel the same regarding my intilegences (see I cant even spells right). I keep on doubting myself and trying different stuff. I just cannot accept that something like this would use something as trivial as randbetween().

Although that is something to look into I must admit..
 
I deleted my "loot Nanny" datasets due i got the confirmations i was looking for.
mainly... number of loot events "forces" the randomizer to give you a MULTI.
the more you shot the more you have chances.
also multi's have a distribution in amplitude so some are 9x some are 250x
remove the idea of a "pattern" and think to a skewed distribution
that allows to apply "risk control rules" as if it was a stock market return, brownian motion....
it is just LOOT = (RND)*PEDin as per tt value
then there is a more complex formula on shraps and items part division based on DPP
there there is a selector for WHAT item in loot table you are allowed to get according to the amount of loot dedicated to the item part
a global allows in rextelum to obtain a weapon just because weapons ahve high TT value
killing argonauts allows a small Chip to be looted without a global because TT is under its value,
That is why i prefer DPP to EFF... i want a NON-Shrapnel part as big as possible
(eff and DPP often go isde by dside)
but again,, we have own theories but the above is linear and simple.... why using rocket science when a normal randomizer is ok?
WOW, CABAL, DIABLO3... the only differnce is that Entropia return LESS than decay otehrwise would be a Diablo3-like (focusblow-critical chance works exactly in the same way)
 
What would the game look like if these stastical maths were used in the game?

Can the stats guys provide me with some average stats for mining and allow me the opportunity to break their predictions?

Does this sound like fun?
 
Msturlese said:
I deleted my "loot Nanny" datasets due i got the confirmations i was looking for.
mainly... number of loot events "forces" the randomizer to give you a MULTI.
the more you shot the more you have chances.
also multi's have a distribution in amplitude so some are 9x some are 250x
remove the idea of a "pattern" and think to a skewed distribution
that allows to apply "risk control rules" as if it was a stock market return, brownian motion....
it is just LOOT = (RND)*PEDin as per tt value
then there is a more complex formula on shraps and items part division based on DPP
there there is a selector for WHAT item in loot table you are allowed to get according to the amount of loot dedicated to the item part
a global allows in rextelum to obtain a weapon just because weapons ahve high TT value
killing argonauts allows a small Chip to be looted without a global because TT is under its value,
That is why i prefer DPP to EFF... i want a NON-Shrapnel part as big as possible
(eff and DPP often go isde by dside)
but again,, we have own theories but the above is linear and simple.... why using rocket science when a normal randomizer is ok?
WOW, CABAL, DIABLO3... the only differnce is that Entropia return LESS than decay otehrwise would be a Diablo3-like (focusblow-critical chance works exactly in the same way)
Click to expand...
Agreed, one question tho: didnt we have confirmation somewhere, that items add tt and not "take" from it? I seem to remember something like that but cant seem to find it or remember the method used to show it. By items i mean L or unL just not oils and other stackables. Ill continue looking but i coulda sworn i read it and felt the evidende convincing.
 
While were also at it, Are you at all related to the guy who posts their horrible suggestions to mindark 12 times a day?
 
Thark said:
Agreed, one question tho: didnt we have confirmation somewhere, that items add tt and not "take" from it? I seem to remember something like that but cant seem to find it or remember the method used to show it. By items i mean L or unL just not oils and other stackables. Ill continue looking but i coulda sworn i read it and felt the evidende convincing.
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for me it is Shoraps and "non-shraps" that include stackables and also non stackables (armor, tools(weapon and de, healing( and implants,)
the choide from "non shraps" is a random choice on the loot table.
and if you game with sound enabled you clearly hear that sometimes a "extra loot" arrives adn there is a delayed second sound (armor parts or chips or some 2nd shrapnel line"
so all in all there is also a chance of "loot bonus roll" that occursa delayed past the normal one.
 
Angela Draniie Cloud said:
While were also at it, Are you at all related to the guy who posts their horrible suggestions to mindark 12 times a day?
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I have never suggested any changes to MA... But they could fix the refiner... It's annoying..
 
One more thing I can say, do not think of your peds as currency, its a matter of time that you will have to deposit again and again and again and again ... You get the picture. This game is NOT what we think it is..
 
R4tt3xx said:
One more thing I can say, do not think of your peds as currency, its a matter of time that you will have to deposit again and again and again and again ... You get the picture. This game is NOT what we think it is..
Click to expand...
Not sure what you mean by this game is not what we think it is? It's common knowledge that you lose money over time, the game is designed that way.

List of official statments pertaining to loot post 2.0

Since i've been getting questions in-game requesting sources for statements I've made it appears as though many players have missed these statements. Figured I´d save them in a post so I can just link this post instead of having to find the posts each time, as well as inform anyone on PCF who...
www.planetcalypsoforum.com www.planetcalypsoforum.com
 
I believe the answer to be simple and it's based on a combination of the following:

MrFatBoy said:
slot machine
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slot_machine
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+
San said:
That's a good one. Can I suggest
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entropy
Click to expand...

To avoid it being classified as gambling, MindArk gives players a way to influence the RTP. For hunting, this would be confirmed with the tests @Jhereg did with looter levels and efficiency. For crafting, it would be blueprint QR and quantity/condition slider. For mining, I'm unsure, perhaps depth and finder?

The big questions I think that needs to be asked is if individual skills influence anything other than profession levels and if mobs/bps/areas/finders/etc all individually have their own RTPs set, like different slots would. This is where Entropy would come into play. Change too many variables and put peds into too many different areas of the game and you end up with your avatar's RTP all out of whack. I've seen best results when being consistent and focused on one thing but it's just anecdotal. Has anyone ever tested this?
 
R4tt3xx said:
I am going to go off topic but here is something interesting..

I have a sequence of numbers from 1 to m I also lets say have a forumla e^(m). I can convert that formula into a spiral x=cos(e^(m))*sqrt(m) y =-sin(e^(m))*sqrt(m)

heres a little red herring for you e^4= ?? Any miner will recognize the result. I think you see why I am so interested in testing these number systems against the game and seeing what they do..
Click to expand...
Have you ever heard of Numberphile?


You remind me of them for some reason, lol.


Interesting thoughts here in your thread. Thanks
 
index.php
 
I remember someone telling me the theory that you can make lots of money by sweating. Perhaps you should test that out?
 
R4tt3xx said:
It could have slot machine like mechanics. But each time you miss, you are guaranteed to hit something larger in the future. Think of it like a debt that the game owes you that will eventually come due when you press the right buttons and of course the buttons change depending on what is owed.
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i'l let you know when i get that "something larger" in the future.

Just let me know what retirement home you plan on going to so i know where to call you at in 40 years lol
 
The Great Adventurer said:
I believe the answer to be simple and it's based on a combination of the following:


+


To avoid it being classified as gambling, MindArk gives players a way to influence the RTP. For hunting, this would be confirmed with the tests @Jhereg did with looter levels and efficiency. For crafting, it would be blueprint QR and quantity/condition slider. For mining, I'm unsure, perhaps depth and finder?

The big questions I think that needs to be asked is if individual skills influence anything other than profession levels and if mobs/bps/areas/finders/etc all individually have their own RTPs set, like different slots would. This is where Entropy would come into play. Change too many variables and put peds into too many different areas of the game and you end up with your avatar's RTP all out of whack. I've seen best results when being consistent and focused on one thing but it's just anecdotal. Has anyone ever tested this?
Click to expand...
I would agree with this...

And yes,, I think there is a way to manipulate fate as it were for mining. Tools and skills are a part of it. But it's also up to the avatars controller themselves to do something well unexpected.
 
ChairmanEdgewise said:
Have you ever heard of Numberphile?


You remind me of them for some reason, lol.


Interesting thoughts here in your thread. Thanks
Click to expand...
Numberphile did do a piece on the sacks spiral which I found interesting. I don't think that MA can directly copy the discovery as it's copyright.

I am not nearly as geeky as them.
 
There are things in this game that only geeks will pick up on, especially computer and math geeks.
 
Mac said:
index.php
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So spirals to me and how this game uses them are very interesting. Every time You global, a spiral appears... That is a fact.

Move on the I think on the s curve of the spiral, the straight one with the squared numbers on it when mining and see what happens. You should see the game trigger some events..
 
Yazuki said:
Not sure what you mean by this game is not what we think it is? It's common knowledge that you lose money over time, the game is designed that way.

List of official statments pertaining to loot post 2.0

Since i've been getting questions in-game requesting sources for statements I've made it appears as though many players have missed these statements. Figured I´d save them in a post so I can just link this post instead of having to find the posts each time, as well as inform anyone on PCF who...
www.planetcalypsoforum.com www.planetcalypsoforum.com
Click to expand...
That is not what I mean.. If this game had Steam Tags I would add "Puzzler" to the list.
 
Msturlese said:
for me it is Shoraps and "non-shraps" that include stackables and also non stackables (armor, tools(weapon and de, healing( and implants,)
the choide from "non shraps" is a random choice on the loot table.
and if you game with sound enabled you clearly hear that sometimes a "extra loot" arrives adn there is a delayed second sound (armor parts or chips or some 2nd shrapnel line"
so all in all there is also a chance of "loot bonus roll" that occursa delayed past the normal one.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure this delay comes from the game needing to fetch textures/info/graphics for one of the items you loot. If you look at the loot chat log they all arrive at the same time (the order of the delayed item can also be different in the chat log).
 
The Great Adventurer said:
I believe the answer to be simple and it's based on a combination of the following:


+


To avoid it being classified as gambling, MindArk gives players a way to influence the RTP. For hunting, this would be confirmed with the tests @Jhereg did with looter levels and efficiency. For crafting, it would be blueprint QR and quantity/condition slider. For mining, I'm unsure, perhaps depth and finder?

The big questions I think that needs to be asked is if individual skills influence anything other than profession levels and if mobs/bps/areas/finders/etc all individually have their own RTPs set, like different slots would. This is where Entropy would come into play. Change too many variables and put peds into too many different areas of the game and you end up with your avatar's RTP all out of whack. I've seen best results when being consistent and focused on one thing but it's just anecdotal. Has anyone ever tested this?
Click to expand...
Yes if you do lots things like little and large as I call it it completely messes up your loot. Generally it will just suck ped no matter what you switch to.

Also point out skill based games and social games don't come under Sweden gambling commission and they still need to show it's not entirely chance based. Maybe someone from Sweden can do freedom information request for Lols to see what classification entropia is.
 
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Belief is the mother of all fruitless errands, wasted life journeys, all the way to sectarian conflicts. It has its place in evolution as a survival mechanism, a heuristic method when it was essential to make quick decisions from incomplete information (e.g. spotting a tiger in the grass). Scrap it where not strictly necessary to try out something new. Relying on solid data is standing on the shoulders of giants. And don't forget, we're not dealing with nature here, only with a game designed by humans with some elements of real-physics simulation.
 
San said:
Belief is the mother of all fruitless errands, wasted life journeys, all the way to sectarian conflicts. It has its place in evolution as a survival mechanism, a heuristic method when it was essential to make quick decisions from incomplete information (e.g. spotting a tiger in the grass). Scrap it where not strictly necessary to try out something new. Relying on solid data is standing on the shoulders of giants. And don't forget, we're not dealing with nature here, only with a game designed by humans with some elements of real-physics simulation.
Click to expand...
Sure, belief is one thing. But Mindark has something else in mind for this little project.
You would have to use your perception skill to find it.

OH, computr and mafamac ... mathematics are also required.

Too much ?
 
Now MA is a listed company. so need to fgive bigger disclosures to market participants.
let's wait for next balance account
and dont forget that on forum there was a reference on published paper from MA on how system is based.
 
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