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The true meaning of perception

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Spawn

Spawn

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It has been discussed to the bone over and over. The reason why I post this now, is that I have never laid it out in a thread (only in replies to other threads)

legion said:

Perception = a smaller cluster, can be just 2 claims, a rarer find, a bigger find above ~5 ped. It might also indicate another person outside your radar but cant be sure on that one.
Click to expand...

This is a close but not total description of what perception really does.

And since Mindark gave legion such a clear go ahead, I will follow.

Perception will give you a clear indication that something nice is within your grasp. Something nice can be ore, enmatter or a mini (hunting loot). It will drop in 90% of the cases if you follow the instructions below.

To use perception in the right way, you have to be a totaller.

A totaller is somebody who both hunts, mines ore and enmatter.
Basically you hunt with eco gear, until you gain perception.

what to do when you gain perception:
Don't move!
first you drop a bomb. if it hits drop one more, if it doesn't drop a probe.
If both do not hit, then you kill the mobs within your radar range.
one of the mobs will loot something better then normal.
So if an atrax normally loots 1,3 peds then with a perception gain, and the bomb/probe didn't hit you will get something that is a bit better, like a 5-15 pedder.
YOU will hit something nice in 90% of the cases. In most of the cases it's a level 3 ore or enmatter.
Other sources have claimed that in the other case (no good loot, no ore and no enmatter) fruit or dung can be found. I have never experienced this. I cannot confirm it.

I have been using this for the last years, and it works. It will not make you profit, but it will surely help to stretch the pedcard.

NOTE: This is only true if you hunt and then get a perception gain.

Now with added video (in hd on the youtube site to see the letters):

first one.. i kill an atrax, get a perception gain. Kill the other trax, then drop a bomb and bam, modest lyst.




second one

kill some more trax and wurms and get a perception and a new rank in perception. kill the mobs off , drop a bomb and i get a level 3 iron


third one part 1

I get a perception after killing a berycled.. i drop a bomb and a probe, but realise i had moved while getting the perception. Both do not hit. So i start killing some mobs. Results in part 2 (video automatically split by fraps)



third one part 2

I kill some more mobs and get my prize of 117 peds. (go check entropiatracker you non-believer!)
Mob Maturity Loot value Time
Atrax Provider 117 PED Thursday, March 05, 2009 22:0


 
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Close, but no cigar.:trout:
 
Look for stones/fruit/dung too. I am pretty positive that someone just off radar will give you perc as well.
 
It may mean that. But then does it also mean that if you don`t get a serendipity gain along with it you won`t be lucky enough ti find it. I find these perception speculations a poor attempt at trying to find the golden ticket. Perception does`nt mean shit.
 
Lucky Seven said:
Close, but no cigar.:trout:
Click to expand...

It may mean that. But then does it also mean that if you don`t get a serendipity gain along with it you won`t be lucky enough ti find it. I find these perception speculations a poor attempt at trying to find the golden ticket. Perception does`nt mean shit.
Click to expand...

no speculation, years of experience.
proof of the pudding is in the eating:

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]
 
HinDragoz said:
and only got 5 times claim with perc gain?

sure.. I can gain any skill before I get a claim...
Click to expand...


I thought 5 screenies would be enough. A one hour video maybe?
How many screenies would i have to post?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorn
Perception does`nt mean shit.

I agree
Click to expand...

I would say, since 5 screenies aren't enough, post 20 screenies of your next 20 perception gains and you are not getting something nice using my method. If it doesnt mean shit, you can have those screenies within the hour. If it will take longer and 50% of the claims give you a claim or good loot, start wondering.
Prove me wrong, I have done my part.
 
Spawn said:
no speculation, years of experience.
proof of the pudding is in the eating:
Click to expand...

I'm not so sure I would call those pics proof of anything. Notice the little scroll thingy is half way up the chat box in most of the pics. Lots of time passing by. The second one looks convincing though.
 
I will try on my next mining run. Thanks for the advice, will try to confirm later (50 probes only, though - no ore/wep)
 
AuroricShiva said:
I will try on my next mining run. Thanks for the advice, will try to confirm later (50 probes only, though - no ore/wep)
Click to expand...


then don't. It only works if you do all three. hunt,ore and enmatter.
 
Nicholas Ash said:
I'm not so sure I would call those pics proof of anything. Notice the little scroll thingy is half way up the chat box in most of the pics. Lots of time passing by. The second one looks convincing though.
Click to expand...

the scroll box is half way up, because i am hunting.
I always kill my mob first, then drop a bomb. so not a lot of time past, a lot of space past saying " you did so and so damage"

I will install fraps soon to do a movie, since you are being so sceptic.
Last thing i will say about it: I am not lying to you. It works for me in this way.
 
ONLY when you do all three? Or would there be a 1:3 probability of striking something if doing only probes?
 
AuroricShiva said:
ONLY when you do all three? Or would there be a 1:3 probability of striking something if doing only probes?
Click to expand...

I don't know. I only know that it works while HUNTING, and carrying bombs and probes and using the bombs and probes only when you get a perception gain.
I am unsure about perception gains while MINING. Legion claims it works about the same, so it could be that it works like you say.
 
I heard about the perception thing years ago. So I`ve always tried to find some truth in it. The fact is I never get the good stuff after gains. Of course you`ll reply with because I probably was`nt doing all three. But I`ve done this for over 3 years. And I won`t waste the time with screenies. You can`t teach things to brick walls. Fact is MA knows all and we know nothing. We are all just speculators here on just about every topic concerning how things work and it`s kind of silly. MA has the ability to change things and does with the click of a button. And they surely would if we were even close to getting an edge on the system. Perception is a skill like any other. We always get gains. To say that everytime it scolls by means something is naive at best and assinine at it`s worst. So I`m done with my 2 cents and said what I have to say. Now I`m off to dispell the myth of Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny.
 
I could also give you 100 screenies where i get a good loot, deposit, whatever after every possible skillgain ...

And a tiny after a perception gain ... that's not really convincing :silly2:
 
well, next time i take a mining trip, ill just double drop when i get a perception gain. try something new :)
 
Spawn said:
And since Mindark gave legion such a clear go ahead, I will follow.

Perception will give you a clear indication that something nice is within your grasp. Something nice can be ore, enmatter or a mini (hunting loot). It will drop in 90% of the cases if you follow the instructions below.
Click to expand...
  • Why would MA give you a hint about something nice in your radius. (that would be like a lottery ticket having a gold line on the side notifying the roll has a winning ticket within 10 pieces)
  • If that would be so, it means loot is not avatar related but decided by spawn.
  • Perception is just a skill that you gain when you doing certain professions it contributes to.

Stop trying to break the loot system, its not possible I sometimes get tired with all the theories. I skype allot with a friend, and it always comes back to the, what if, and perhaps bla bla loot, how bla..

Argh I will go nuts some day.
 
Thorn said:
I heard about the perception thing years ago. So I`ve always tried to find some truth in it. The fact is I never get the good stuff after gains. Of course you`ll reply with because I probably was`nt doing all three. But I`ve done this for over 3 years. And I won`t waste the time with screenies. You can`t teach things to brick walls. Fact is MA knows all and we know nothing. We are all just speculators here on just about every topic concerning how things work and it`s kind of silly. MA has the ability to change things and does with the click of a button. And they surely would if we were even close to getting an edge on the system. Perception is a skill like any other. We always get gains. To say that everytime it scolls by means something is naive at best and assinine at it`s worst. So I`m done with my 2 cents and said what I have to say.
Click to expand...



I 100% agree with this... I have hunted my ass off 1000's of peds in a day and mined 1000's of peds in a short time and got 100's of perception gains and still have never got anythign special that says perception gains means anything.. Again along the same lines that thorn said the only way to prove anything is steal all the code from MA ( not a sugesstion)
 
The fact is that from a programming sense, to code in something like that would make no sense. They want to design a system that is random and unbeatable. Having such a "system" would not be in their best interests at all.

Skills are values with names, which contribute to a professional level. That is all, no more no less.

As humans we do try to look for patterns in the random, you may notice that after a perc gain you get a good loot within 1 second - 5 mins, but what you attribute that to could be anything, not necessarily the skill gain.

I have 2400 points in perception now... and where have my good loots been?
 
Henceforth said:
  • Why would MA give you a hint about something nice in your radius. (that would be like a lottery ticket having a gold line on the side notifying the roll has a winning ticket within 10 pieces)

    because otherwise it would be a gambling game?
  • If that would be so, it means loot is not avatar related but decided by spawn.

    finally you understand my young padawan.. loot is decided by Spawn
Click to expand...


  • ...............
 
Spawn said:
...............
Click to expand...

:D you misplaced your reply inside the quote, but nice word trick, I meant the spawn of the mob of course ;)

anyway:

I see every mob as potential "ticket" and the eco means how much you buy that ticket for, and the basic cost to "buy" that ticked (HP) decides the payout.

In this way, yes its gambling, but you also have your own skills what create more eco in defense and the ability of item use.
 
so, every perception gain leads to a 5 ped loot in mining or nearby mob.

why 5 ped? why not 2, 10 or a variable amount tied to the average of the mob or deposit in question? what about if i get two or three perc gains, does that mean two or three nearby "good" loots or deposits?

how does the theory account for all the perc gains that do not lead to an immediate "good" loot? how is there direct correlation between a perc gain with 20 mobs in radar and getting a 10ped loot 8 minutes later on the 19th mob?

what does it mean when i get a perc gain scanning? Why is there a link to perc gains with players on the edge of the radar at the same time as having a link to loot?

let look at some definitions.
perception: noun 1 the ability to see, hear, or become aware of something through the senses. 2 the process of perceiving. 3 a way of understanding or interpreting something. 4 intuitive understanding and insight

serendipity: noun the occurrence and development of events by chance in a happy or beneficial way.
Click to expand...

what does serendipity mean in EU then, considering it has a close link to perception and its meaning has more relevence to attaining good fortune?


i know the answers to some of these, i have ideas about others. but without answers to all these questions the "theory" is flawed, indeed it is a mere hypothesis.
 
aridash said:
so, every perception gain leads to a 5 ped loot in mining or nearby mob.

why 5 ped? why not 2, 10 or a variable amount tied to the average of the mob or deposit in question? what about if i get two or three perc gains, does that mean two or three nearby "good" loots or deposits?

how does the theory account for all the perc gains that do not lead to an immediate "good" loot? how is there direct correlation between a perc gain with 20 mobs in radar and getting a 10ped loot 8 minutes later on the 19th mob?

what does it mean when i get a perc gain scanning? Why is there a link to perc gains with players on the edge of the radar at the same time as having a link to loot?

let look at some definitions.


what does serendipity mean in EU then, considering it has a close link to perception and its meaning has more relevence to attaining good fortune?


i know the answers to some of these, i have ideas about others. but without answers to all these questions the "theory" is flawed, indeed it is a mere hypothesis.
Click to expand...

no not all perception gains lead to a 5 pedder. a level 2 or 3 in oil is not 5 peds. or lyst. Most of the drops were this size. Also most of the perception gains lead to ore or enmatter. If they don't lead to ore or enmatter, then a mob is near with something nice. the 5 peds was a mere indication, something better then a normal loot.

If i get a perception gain and i get no ore or enmatter, then i have a high chance of something inside the mobs in my radar view. getting the loot 8 minutes later depends on the gun and the mob. (opalo on an atrox could lead to 8 minutes wait). If you are hunting a low type mob, I wouldn't bother trying to kill 100 mobs inside your radar. but if there are only 5-10.. I would shoot them all.

the perception gain for me only works while hunting. so not scanning or mining, although legion seems to say it is the case for mining as well. I haven't tested that.

theory, hypothesis.. I only wrote down how it works for me in (virtual) reality.
 
I am a true believer in perc gains. I mainly use it only when hunting, haven't been able to find a good pattern for mining. Whenever I gain a perc and hopefully i am not in a big spawn of mobs, I kill everything within radar. 90% of the time it works. 65% of the time it will be a global or hof other 25% of the time it will be an item in the loot or a 20-30 ped loot.
My first hof of 6.6k peds came from a perc gain and was the 3rd mob I killed. Perc gains work best for mobs that are picked up on radar at long range...troxies, feffs, ambi, allo and such. If get a perc gain in a big spawn just go about your business cause it will be to tough to find it. I have gotten a global from mobs due to mining percs but not the other way around yet.
 
Spawn said:
And since Mindark gave legion such a clear go ahead, I will follow.
Click to expand...

Sorry I am not sure what you mean by this ?

Did MA say specifically that perception means something other than part of what builds your profession level and is raised as a % contribution for all weapons, finders etc used.

Or did MA say that it means loot is near ?

Sorry, but I need clarification on what this 'clear' go ahead is ?
 
Lavawalker said:
Sorry I am not sure what you mean by this ?

Did MA say specifically that perception means something other than part of what builds your profession level and is raised as a % contribution for all weapons, finders etc used.

Or did MA say that it means loot is near ?

Sorry, but I need clarification on what this 'clear' go ahead is ?
Click to expand...

legion said:
Today i got a reply from ma on my supportcase about if they would change stuff if i disclosed it to the community and this is what it said.


Quote:
Thank you for your inquiry.

There are several theories regarding loot out there, if you wish to publish your theory we will not stop you.

As you may understand we can not comment this case any further, we encourage participants to theorize around how things work in Entropia Universe.

Kind regards,
Entropia Universe Support
Click to expand...

hope that clarifies the go-ahead..

they ofcourse not specifically say, if they will change it.. (i hope they don't)
 
Spawn said:
legion said:

hope that clarifies the go-ahead..

they ofcourse not specifically say, if they will change it.. (i hope they don't)
Click to expand...

Yep :D it does.
Keep the theories & mystery alive ofc ;)

Aye,

MindArk can not tell any participant of any changes to the Entropia System (blackboxed mechanics) or upcoming additions/changes to infrastructure, future plans, you name it, (Nadda outside what your directly proposing/requesting) until patch time :)

It is company policy no matter who you may be, even if you have hundreds of thousands of USD invested into the system.

One of the first points brought to my attention whilst in present consultation with MindArk over my own proposal :)
 
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This is quite simple, just because you CAN get skillgains when you find a claim, doesn't mean that when you get one that it means anything. If you *always* got perception when you got a claim, then I would concede that it means something. But because we all know for a FACT you don't, and that the vast majority of claims you do NOT get a perception skill gain we can conclude it doesn't mean anything.

It's common knowledge that skills come in a specific ratio, like here. We know you'll receive about 5% of all your skills in perception while mining. If you only get 5% of your skills as perception, how can it mean something? Simple logic here.
 
* deleted *
 
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I'll just quote neomaven from a post awhile ago:

6550-perception.jpg
 
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