$15.00 a month?

You mean there is a graph in game that shows that MA is losing more customers than it gains....??? That there is less money in the in game economy than last year...???

I'll take their numbers... as they have to prove them to potential investor and planet partners...;)

When a new player joins it adds up MA's count..When a player never logs in again it does not subtract from that count.

Get it yet? pretty easy to understand.
 
Active participants have to log in now and again or they get their items and accounts wiped, it doesnt mean they are that 'active'.

At my most optimistic I would say things are stalled until VU 10.0. I think a lot of people are waiting for the 2nd golden age of loot. :)

Yes and that means they are still active and want to continue their account rather than cashing out... and walking away... there are a lot reasons not to play everyday and many take breaks and come back... but the player base keeps growing... :)

I think the EU under 15 dollars a month guide will be very useful... for many players and welcome addtion. I hope to contribute to it over the weekend...
 
I hear what you are saying regarding prices, my point is the system.... its wild, unpredictable and kills players ped cards if they dare step off the snable or snots.

Loots are wild, they have no logic and therefore cant be used to gauge how well your avatar is doing... so whats the point?

As I have posted, I lost 500 ped on mid longu over 1200ped of ammo and had a very efficient setup, went to falx where I get horrible fap and armor decay and got a profit of 700 ped :scratch2:

It happens like that all the time, where is the logic? Top hunters can hunt dasp and I bet an Atrox young/mature or an ambu will be top of the hof list... where is the logic in that?

Oh I agree 100% :thumbup: It seems at times the system rewards foolish behavior... ya know..? I cringe when I see a global of 50 PED on a Dasp Stalker... no way in hell that thing should not HoF with each kill considering it costs about 50 PED to kill one :laugh: The illogical aspect it what keeps us on our toes otherwise I suppose we would all find that magic mob and camp it forever.
 
When a new player joins it adds up MA's count..When a player never logs in again it does not subtract from that count.

Get it yet? pretty easy to understand.

That's not true recently they said they were clearing all inactive accounts after I think two years...so the list is current...don't you think other planet investors and news people in the industry would have challenged their numbers on the same basis... that what you need to get and understand... If you can think of it others more knowledgable in the industy can to... and those are the people investing really big time... in the validy of those numbers...
 
The illogical aspect it what keeps us on our toes otherwise I suppose we would all find that magic mob and camp it forever.

Its not that, the problem is you will never find a mob or a level you will be able to hunt within a reasonable loss bracket. Without that guide you dont know where you are, it seems it doesnt matter what you do its all up in the air and it just depends if its your lucky day. Its crazy, its not a smart way to promote building an avatar.

How many people would like to hear that an lvl 90 average in hit and damage in blp rifle with no decay on fap or armour could lose 500 ped in a 1200 ped hunt on mid maturity Longu?

Why bother skilling up when that happens :scratch2: A smart system would reduce the variance of loot on mobs as you progressed up the system, as it is even at lvl 90 you can lose $50 in a few hours hunting very average mob... is that smart? Does that make you think "I want to develop my avatar to lvl90"?

No its crazy, the system is "broken". Fix the system and get back to a global or hof actually meaning a good thing instead of just a top up of the insane variance of loot then we have a game again. Until then its just log in, will I make or will I lose - no way of telling regardless of my avatars skills or gear.
 
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...Why bother skilling up when that happens :scratch2: ...

Valid points, Tekkie. I, myself, have only viewed skills as a measure of how efficiently I use certain tools and weapons. I never considered that skills should relate to loot. Skilling up, to me, is just getting better at the action... not the result of the action. An exception may be crafting, but I am not a crafter so I can't really say.

Fewer missed shots, more damage per shot, and the ability to not get hit as often are the only things I look forward to when and if I ever get to your level. Until then, I resist the temptation to go after mobs I consider out of my league. Based on your experience with Longu and then the Falx however, that thought process may be flawed.
 
The loot-skills thing isnt the problem, its the variance in loot that kills people and makes them leave the game with harsh feelings.

MA come on a forum and ask for advice for new players on how to play this game for $15 a month? Hunt med Longu for example with good gear and skills for a few hours, thats the first 3 months gone before mid-day.

Im pushing this strongly because either MA dont know how their own loot system works or they are just ignoring the problems within it.

In all honesty, the best advice I could give to a gamer who wants fun and action for $15 a month is dont ever log into EU because even if you are lvl 90 and have good gear you could lose a years worth of deposits in a very short period of time indeed.

MA are fully aware of this, at this point if they cant see the obvious problems with the system they have created then there really is no help for them - or thier business plan.
 
as it is even at lvl 90 you can lose $50 in a few hours hunting very average mob... is that smart? Does that make you think "I want to develop my avatar to lvl90"?

Losing $50 on Longu doesn't make me want to develop my avatar, but the fact that you soon afterwards profited $70 on Falx for a net of $20 does... :D
 
(Newcomers who wish for help, read the end)

The way I see it is this $15 a month thing is an insult at the moment because no amount of fun that can be had in this game is worth the large quantities of $10-30 an hour that this game can often cost. While the times when we do not lose nearly as much, and I'm talking korss h400+105 hunting with an efficient fap and everything, are somewhat fun, the only real fun in this game at the moment seems to the be the gamble aspect. Some people see it is worth it, and this does not make this a 'bad' game, but I believe for them to work for a better market strategy would be to make this game where you can have that nice gun and have a nice set of armor on very little money, where your average joe can deposit say, $50 a month and not expect to lose it over that time entirely.

I pray that this post is not modified or deleted as this is a reality that we much face and would only like to leave this here as a suggestion. At one point it indeed was a very very fun game for the quantities of money it cost. You could go out hunting every day and if you hunted away say, $100 in a month you could have paid your rent for a home and gotten maybe a cool new piece of furnature or so. You saw many cool hunts, went exotic places and fought things where it was the difficulty of the mob that was a problem not the size of your pocketbook.
We used to be able to go to Club Neverdie and purchase things because it never hurt us too bad. So what if we went and tried out that new limited club. It won't set us back too terribly and was great fun it was something new. For the rest of the month we could still go and have some fun, there were new things to be seen and an entire new universe to see. Unfortunately though over time it seems that costs have gone up entirely too much, we never get those little twinkles anymore, such as that gun we could use that was better than what we had, or that limited piece of armor from a hunt where we'd lost a bit, atleast we had something that protected us slightly better. We never get a purpose to hunt besides to be a drone, skill up towards not much besides faster ways to lose money, never any real fun like other games of all varieties rely on to sell.
This game used to have globals and hall of fames as the giant things that made the celebrities. Everyone had a chance and when we got one which we often would get(globals, not hofs) then we were really happy. It often put a nice item into our hands and a small profit. While this glee often resulted in us blowing up larger than we could handle objects and shooting the ground and ringmates, we had our fun even if they managed to squeeze a few pennies out of us. We wouldn't feel bad ;).

They have to listen. They have a large fan base, but cannot keep new players easily. Please stick with us but pressure Mindark to pursue a more effective market strategy. If they lower their costs and bring in many players they will breed many new things such as:
Many more players to socialize and a larger advertisement base, thus larger profile, thus larger draw.
Many more lasting contracts with the company that will enable more things to be done better for Mindark while keeping their costs low.
People who are willing to take that $50 they spent a month before and increase it because of a vast fun factor that could be had.
Expansion of in game facilities. More people will want to use the banks, more people will want homes, more people will want to travel to the asteroid and station in the sky, etc. etc. etc.
More profit margins for the people who run businesses since we might actually have a little bit of ped to spend for a change on avatar improvement with that $15 a month. So what if it takes us two months to save up for some 'work'.

The community in here is one thing the game has going incredibly, though and together I believe that we can help everyone. Mindark has the capability to empower their fanbase in a Stockholm syndrome like manner. Why not allow the players to have a symbiotic relationship with the company instead of them having a parasitic relationship solely on our wallet?

To newcomers:
THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART---------------------------------
Newcomers, please do stay but make your voices very loud that you wish for change!
Say you start off sweathunting, you want MORE you want FUN! Don't put any more money in when you don't have fun and simply state your opinion loudly.
I feel that Frank's thread is a public embarrassment to himself and the entire company. Nobody can provide any real effective ways to survive on anything close to $15 a month that provide even an inch of fun to the player, so I feel that this is their chance to realize this situation and fix it. The fun factor will easily be fixed in Cryengine stages once the planet partners step in, I feel Mindark needs to help the financial side and boost the entertainment side where it still can.

Side Comment:
Frank, Marco, or anyone who reads this before it is modified or deleted could you please private message me? I feel that it is time for MA to let one of you have a nice long ORDERLY chat with the community where we can express opinions and get some not-so-dodgy answers to our questions about what you can do about these situations we find outselves in. Atleast give us some fun.
We all see the financial reports. Why don't they pay you guys enough to atleast put an hour a day into the forums with active posting? 10 Posts a day on ACTUAL problems as well as the usual posting about the good things would provide a healthy balance. Going to those conventions is only going to raise skeptics and keep nobody in game. It is the members of this forum that will recruit real life friends and family far more effectively and at a lower cost point than those conventions in those jets.

Please wish this post luck and hope it is not condemned.
 
Please wish this post luck and hope it is not condemned.

People have said much worse on EF. I think you'll be fine... ;)

But I honestly don't believe the loot system needs to be tweaked much. Since we're talking about real money here, the most important thing in this universe is PEDs. To get ahead and move up, you need PEDs. You can get PEDs by depositing or using your noggin within the game. But we can't all make PEDs here. If everyone makes PEDs easily, then no one deposits. If no one deposits and it's still possible to withdraw, then EU will cease to exist.

The only way to accomplish what many of you want here is to not allow people to withdraw their PEDs. But if we can't withdraw our PEDs, all we're left with is a subscription or micro payment game, just like every other MMO out there.

The name of the game here is survival. It's sink or swim and the person with the highest PED card wins. There are plenty of successful non-depositors out there and numerous other once-upon-a-time depositors that have found ways to stay afloat and even make a little extra. If that type of game doesn't interest you, then EU probably isn't going to do it for you... unless of course you're the compulsive gambler type, in which case, I encourage you to keep depositing and spending PEDs. That all time high should be coming soon for you! :thumbup:
 
I've played this game for less than 10 euros a month for the last four years, though I haven't deposited anything in over a year.
 
Logic does not exist in EU. It is built up by many different brain/brainless people. A boss/stockholders that needs profit and a staff with some guys who what to change things for better but can't do it all the way.
So, that is what we have now.

I call it a mess, in their eyes it's a sort of compromise.
 
after reading many of the post here i figure i should give my 2 pecs!

Can i play for $15? Yes
Do i choose to play for that? No
Why?

A simple little thing called adrenaline, i used to get my adrenaline rushes from racing down the highway at 120+mph, but now that i am older i choose to look for a safer way to get my rush, and the answer is by hunting hogs or young spiders. With 75k skills and 127 health hogs and spiders are just right for me, challenging. So far in my avi's life i havent found anything that provides as big of a rush as killin a hog or spider, knowing that at anytime they could very easily kill me with 1 hit, and having another spawn near and attack while im still killin the first just makes the battle more epic, adding to the rush. can i get that rush hunting low-med lv mobs? NO, there is no rush when me can sit still for 30 minutes not doing anything while an exarosaur attacks me non stop, hardly ever hitting me and with crits maxing at around 60-70 dmg, to my kids they love exa and combibo so i do hunt them in order to make them happy, but i usally fall asleep after about 25-30 ped of ammo! Never once have i fallen asleep on hogs

Now if MA really wants people to be able to play for $15(and have fun) a month then perhaps they should add a mob that can do great dmg(60-70dmg avg, 130 crits) and have low health(3-400 health)

as far as setting up a steady stream of income by trading, in my opinion the average player coming into Entropia comes in wanting to blow away some mobs(lets face it violence is in our nature) not take on a second job of sweating or trading, and to hunt the upper lv mobs u literally do have to take up a second job, unless u are extremely lucky(and i have had my fair share of luck, just check my tracker)

And now i leave u with these words: "I love Entropia, and i hate it. It is the best game every made, and at the same time it is the worst! To me its not about the Money, its about the RUSH!"
 
"MA are fully aware of this, at this point if they cant see the obvious problems with the system they have created then there really is no help for them - or thier business plan. " I think MA understands the game / loot system is broken. Here is why, why would they use the term "GoldenAge". Using this term means that things were better only within these "Goldenages" everything outside these is less, MA knows this. They hiwever have not been clear as what they will do fix it. Only when the GA2 will start. 2nd because they have used this term, I know I'm not playing in a GA. Which means I will loose my funds 90% to 98% of the time. Maybe we should just all come back and start playing again when GA2 get here. My question to MA is how long will the nest GA last? That way I know when I can stop playing.
 
The film will never change, the people from the "im not entertained" camp as you choose to put it probably hope that EU will change for the better and achieve its potential and be the best virtual universe out there.
Yes.

Maybe MA really think that in the industry of online games they already have a product that can beat the others for $15 a month...... without feedback they will never know if they are right or wrong, and without feedback it will never change unless the problems are brought to thier attention.
Given what i have read here on EF over the years i think they should have gotten all they would need - problem seems to be more in the execution phase.

We really need to stop seeing negative posts as "moaning" or "complaining" on this forum and get out of the culture of simply dismissing them as such. Its actually the best information to aid MA in making things better.
Thanks for clear thinking.

I think the one thing to consider is that every month you would be ADDING $15 to your account. It's not like each month you deposit your $15, that money all goes to MA and you have nothing to show for it (well, unless you're just stupid with your money... if you're bad with money this game isn't going to be your cup of tea...).
Hahaha.

So each month, if you're playing wisely (many suggestions have already been made here on how to do that so I wont rehash those points), you should be able to come in around breaking even. Maybe a little less, maybe a little more. So let's assume you now have $14 in your account now after your first month. Next month comes around for your deposit and you now have $29 in your account. Play wisely again and maybe you'll have $28. Next deposit you'll have $43.
Which is only true as long as you online time is severly limited or you go online to work.

if you are not making a continuous and steady income whether it’s 1 ped a week or 10.000 peds then you have no claim to any uber status… much less having mastered the FPC scenario… much less having good advice on how to positively improve FPC...
Translates to me as 'if you are not white then you have no right to vote'.

When you only ask the ones who profit from a system for ideas of improvement then you quickly arrive at the current RL scenario that a small group plunders the fruits of the work of the community without any humaneness while getting in a mindset which makes them percive john doe as unworthy and expendable.

After all that is the ultimate challenge of being a colonist on a distant planet… It’s not about playing for 15 dollars a month…. It’s about making a profit and in this tough scenario it requires all you imagination… knowledge… business savvy and patience to do so… that’s the real investment of time and energy… to live here… otherwise you just a tourist looking for an easy lay…
Last time i excrete this into the void:

The complaints are not about 'not making profit', they are about 'not enough fun for the buck' because the bucks are often melting like snowballs thrown into the sun.

Now: Can someone please explain to me how i can completely ignore users here so that i don't have to ever see something from the again? I'm tired of vaccumheads who continuously state that the ones who struggle in EU are worth shit.

Tussi
 
Don't you guys ever win anything? It amazes me to read people saying they lose/burn dozens or hundreds of peds everydaym but they perhaps forget to mention they win also dozens or hundreds the day after, and therefore, money will not decrease that quick. Ups and downs...
 
Newcomer can play and explore EU planet for many moths without any deposit. EU is so big that newcomer will have a lot of fun in all that time just runing around, colecting TPs and learning about. No 15$ needed.
But that newcomer will not add to loot pol ( and MA pocket ) in that way.
Discusing about 15$/month is wery dangerous - is like discusing about amount of initial deposit newcomer need to buy modfap, shadow or better,modmerc and amount of skills to start hunting proffesion.
Both sides show one of extremes in EU.
Asking player base for best gamplay advice for mounthly budget 15$ can mean at least 2 things.
First that MA continue with politic to not relase any guide or official statement on their offer ( in this case i think balance manager shud know what MA is offering for 15$/mounth ), instead of that they link any responsability to regular players advices on non official forum.
Second - discusing and creating how to play at 15$/mounth treads can create illusion that EU as whole is wery cheap.
Telling that EU is playable at 15$/mounth is like not telling all story and if one do not tell all and hide big part hmm ....
That is dangerous and can be used as false advertising and can create big disapointment and negativity after time to masses of future players.
In the end that may do big damage to EU and all investors.
 
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The game has 3 general areas....

Crafting/Hunting/Mining

Lets assume your getting semi good returns, 80%-90% in any chosen profession. Lets also assume your doing basic low level stuff.

Hunting: Opallo + 15000 ammo, this would last a fair amount of time, as even I get tired of hunting after 2000-3000.

Crafting: 90 (3000) 60 (3000) Lyst/Oil. Wouldn't last very long, but I guess with 80-90% return that might give you a month of solid boredom.

Mining: matter 300 probes... that would depend on play time.


IMO Hunting would last a month, because IMO I cant hunt for very long without getting bored espcially at 2 pec a click.


It all depends, and MA should really let people know.... cause as you skill you quickly (at least I do) get bored of doing the bottom line stuff and want to move up... which usually cost more.....

My sheet metal has netted me 150ped loss in 2 big runs..... Of course they were 80-90% return, but I did big run so it loss that much. If I did smaller runs this might last a little bit longer... but its a downward spiral...
 
theoreticaly you dont even need that . i'm told that bait kk bai doesn't deposit at all and he's up in the top 100 hunters every month...
 
Seriously

Some of the members here are seriously starting to piss me off with the old "once you max p4a/p5a/h400 and have xxx(x) on ped card you never have to deposit again"

Put up a tutorial, with screenshots, movies, indepth explanation, and tell me how the (excuse the french) hell thats supposed to be done?

As ive stated in MANY other threads, ive tried hunting argos with P4a/p5a with or without a101, a102, a103, a104, a105, a106, ive tried hunting small game (daikibas, exos) with anything from opalo, opalo+101, M1a, m2a, m3a, ive tried camping atroxes with various guns and various armor, ive tried hunting with or without armor, with or without fapping, ive tried switching to mining when hunting returns look bad, ive tried skillgain mining, gridmining, carpetbombing, i URGE you to tell me a method that works, because so far NOTHING does.

Ways people have told me, some make me get 50% returns for a short period of time (usually stops "working" after a few hours) which by my standards is a helluva lot when im used to 20-30%, but that said, its not even close to "break even" nontheless profit, these so called "knowitalls" that troll these forums claiming profit on ANYTHING except sweating+trading, where is your (excuse my french again) fucking proof?

Yes, I am getting severely agitated, post a new, prooven bloody tutorial or stop spreading the lies.

// Exo
 
I'd imagine those profiting want to keep it that way. If everyone has the key to profit, no one does.

Something that could be proven while harming no one is the amount you claim to lose. I'd like to see that.
 
Like Joser said many like to keep their methods secret. I can't blame people for that I have mine too.

A big clue is not so much concentrating on the activity and waiting for profit just to happen its about finding and doing the activity(s)that can maximize your returns use the RCE and knowledge of the markets to look for the right things that will bring you closer to break even.
I like hunting CP but it used to be more profitable when alien parts were in demand and the aliens dropped items more frequently. Now its strictly entertainment for me since items are so very far and few between there. Now Planetside? I know what to look for and where to find it so I might be able to turn that 70-80% run into breakeven.

Since day 1 I've played to breakeven and sometimes I profit sometimes I'm even and sometimes I lose. For the most part if I am not getting acceptable returns I can better spend my time elsewhere but if I am on a nice break even streak I play as long as I can to grow myh skills and maybe pop some nice loot.

My biggest frustration is people saying they have done it all and maybe they have done every activity at their level but they always seem to neglect the biggest part of EU which IMHO is the RCE. The activities in EU are just tools its up to us to use them effectively or ineffectively.

It does cost some PED in the beginning if you don't do your research I know I was there once as well and it was not all rosey and peachy like people want to believe PE had just as many challenges as EU and it took time, patience, and personal drive to learn them just like today.

Today there are a lot more help guides in the forums and plenty of people are willing to share info even if that info can make a profit making opportunity more competitive. I would have loved rare ore mining locations and what not in PE it would have saved me a lot of bombs but I would have lost something had it been that way and when I did find something rare the price would have been diluted through competition sort of like it is today except for those items that rarely spawn like dunkel.

Ahhh well I digress it is harder to use the RCE these days but it can be done you just need to be aware of it and look for those opportunities no matter what the activity. Posted via Mobile Device
 
I'd imagine those profiting want to keep it that way. If everyone has the key to profit, no one does.

Something that could be proven while harming no one is the amount you claim to lose. I'd like to see that.

If i ever get to the point where i can afford a "normal" hunt again, how about i fraps it for you so you can see how god awful returns are?
 
Heheh, i'm sure everyone who has played for some time can say that there are the extremely bad periods where nothing works out and you can go mining with 200 bombs and get 0-5peds back (even if you are a seasoned miner and the area/tools have worked very well before but just not during this bad cycle).

And 15 bucks to start as a noobie? Hasn't that been solved already pretty much with the daily noob uber hofs and 3rd day ATH's? :laugh:
 
From a business point of view I see no reason for the way MA have the game set up. It certainly isn't a shock to see the negative comments out there on the web commenting about the game regarding loses and such.

I wonder what the specs are for the servers that MA has, ie max load of players? I may sound crazy but I get the impression MA don't want 100k players online up until now, if they did they would not have adopted the system they are using now.

I think being a RCE most gamers would willingly pay $25 a month for exchange for good entertainment and noticable progression of thier avatar.... plus the chance for a nice hof. But the system seems to be that if you move off the noob mobs and try out an ambu for example then there is a very good chance your ped card is going to get murdered.

That is not going to bring good feeling or retention from a playerbase. Thats basic stuff! So why do we continue playing a game that is viewed mostly as creating a great avatar but skills seem to not matter that much at all? :scratch2:

Back to square one MA and for a minute please consider that everybody out there doesn't want the fake lottery loot system that you seem to think we do and that people want to see improvements in results regarding the hard earned skills they have gained to develop an avatar.

Wild loot can only bring short term joy but the downside is massive when (and it has to be in a RCE) the majority of the time your losing your depo's each month. Get a grip, take responcability for your customers enjoyment and cash and get back to basics of what I see as the main point of any massive multi player online game which is surely the avatar and skills attached to that avatar.

Its pretty basic stuff, don't try and tell me you don't recognise this and the only honest reason I can come up with is that MA's "network" can't handle more players so they have a system set up to get as much money out of each person as possible.

Im sorry to say but faced with the current playerbase after 7 years development, Its the only conclusion I can come to.
 
Some of the members here are seriously starting to piss me off with the old "once you max p4a/p5a/h400 and have xxx(x) on ped card you never have to deposit again"

[...]

As ive stated in MANY other threads, ive tried hunting argos with P4a/p5a with or without a101, a102, a103, a104, a105, a106, ive tried hunting small game (daikibas, exos) with anything from opalo, opalo+101, M1a, m2a, m3a, ive tried camping atroxes with various guns and various armor, ive tried hunting with or without armor, with or without fapping, ive tried switching to mining when hunting returns look bad, ive tried skillgain mining, gridmining, carpetbombing, i URGE you to tell me a method that works, because so far NOTHING does.

[...]

Yes, I am getting severely agitated, post a new, prooven bloody tutorial or stop spreading the lies.

// Exo


first of all, stop calling people liars with no proof at all, please!

furthermore ... you ARE doing somthing wrong ... as do many others it seems, because i hear "20% return, omgomgomg" way too often. 20% return is somewhat im-pos-sible, i don't even get that on scips and i am wayyyyy too noobish for those.

to back this up, here's a screenie of my last two hunting projects ... the second is still in progress. please be aware that i'm a full-time miner and hunt only when i dont have enough time to do a mining run worthwile (thats anything below 3 hours) or when i'm just bored of mining (happens occasionally) ... meaning i dont put nearly as much effort in it as one could and its still looking good:

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

this is just the summary, the full lists i will not make public, as it contains a lot of stuff which cost me time and brains to set up.

feff-setup: naked, P5a+105, SK-20, prey ranging from outcast to warrior
argo-setup: naked, P4a+104, SK-20, prey ranging from young to guardian

after the argo project i will do drones, and i'm sure i will go at least BE on them too ... in the long run that is ...

any questions? pm me. :rolleyes:

S.

PS. and yeah, i'm getting somewhat agitated too when reading posts like yours ... sorry, thats just the way it is, but i'm not calling you anything, i'm trying to sort things out and/or clarify ;)
 
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