Question: Idea of linking shops with auction.

[shoti]

Here is small idea how to improve shops/boths functionality with small effort from MA. If You find it ok, i think it will be worth spam MA support a bit about it.

Idea is to make all items placed for sale in shop automaticaly visible at auction, but without possibility to buying and retreaving it from there. So after sorting auction category f.e. by price u will see if such items is aviable in shop, and lets say get info about wchich shops is that, but in order to buy it u will need to visit that shop personaly.

I see many advantages of that:

* faster info about what is in what shop
* beter competition between shop owners
* shop must suffered lately from sorting functionality added to auction - so small recompenasation
* time saver for shop customers ( no need to walk 2hr and visit all mals to find cheapest thing )

Please vote and comment.

 

[Ace Flyster]

I think, give too much info can ruin the economy

EG rl, getting car insurance, there is no one place that has EVERY price on it, if it did the market for car insurance would collapse and many businesses would go out of business

The same would be in game, if people could easily find the best price for any given item, anywhere in game, then the market for those items would also collapse

People all ready craft stuff at a loss mainly, imagine if there was competition everywhere, more collapse

Just my two pecs

Too much info is bad for an RCE

Rgds

Ace

EDIT: there would also be no point in advertising sales, or less of a point

EDIT2: i do not own a shop and very rarely craft just FYI, incase you thought my opinion was biased

 

[shoti]

well less time spent on seking gun is more time spent in field shoting. I thing that can only help economy in long term.

 

[GoNi]

At the first sight it sounds good, but ...

if you take a closer look, then you should know that most shopowners (those who operate working shops) set prices slightly below auction prices.

This will lead to lower prices from auction traders, as they will start to offer below the shop offers.

Imho this is bad for overall economy and won´t help the shopowners at all, as they will have to adjust prices on a daily base.

More work for the shopowners, and less chance for customers to find a nice offer in the shops, as auction traders surley will offer at lower price than shop prices if those where visible at auction!

 

[Talania]

I suggested this to one of the FPC avatars in Twin Peaks a few months ago.

My idea though didn't include showing prices, just locations.

 

[LeeLoo Faith]

hmm I am not sure.


dont put it into auction
-> have a shop directory instead

I hate running from shop to shop to search for something too
but not sure about prices etc. (similar thoughts like ace/goni) - so maybe just have a listing/Search (auction-like) where to find your item might be great.

but maybe the shopowner should be able to decide wheter the item should be displayed in the directory or not

at least that would safe time running from shop to shop without even seeing/finding the item you want, you would know which shops to go to

 

[Oleg]

No thanks, it's already hard enough to sell my loot.

 

[JingyiDai]

I think it is good idea, otherwise, those shops are pretty useless

MA/FPC is/are trading against its own customer -> the expensive estate owner

Unless shopowners have a fair competition with the auction system

actualy same goes for the shop keepr units..

The system is no fair... at this momment the players have figure out long time... None is gonna buy those new ones....

So MA/FPC dont need to fix it or improve it... they are the one who is sitting their ass on those empty shops lol

So the biggest looser is MA/FPC , not the current owners and the other players...

Burn!!!!!

 

[King Noobis]

Most shop owners just need to lower their prices. Most stores are way more expensive than auction. Maybe they are just lazy and don't adjust thier prices I dunno.

If you advertise and have good priices people will use your shop. If you just want an AFK, no effort $ making investment - I dont think a shop is it.

Maybe shop owners are banking on people that need it right now and are willing to pay too much $ for an item? If so then GL because there are not enough players in this game to get a good volume of desperate people to do that on a regular basis.

No need for MA/FPC/Whoever to spend time fixing something that is not broke. More shop owners just need to put more effort into running a shop. (most not all - some are very active)

And for those active shop owners, maybe need you to review thier pricing and stop thinking 1 or 2 % below market is a great deal when if ur patient you can get better than that in AH on some items. Just cause you bought a shop dosent mean you bought the right to profit easy. Everything takes effort here

 

[Thedarksnw]

Exactly what the first post says does work perfectly in SWG.

 

[M Rufen Power]

I actually like going through the shops in the malls & district areas thats why they are there. Auction seems to have become like the Internet here in EU, the shop is still there, but now you can just look online . Which I don't like, I bought a lot of decent stuff outside of auction, sometimes a bargain sometimes totally expensive. But @ least I know I'm going out of my way to go and look, so what if it saves time I like going through malls just as you would going to a specific store irl. But wait, why don't you use your internet instead to browse through the shop in a 3d flash image on their website? Because its simply stupid, I don't like the idea. Want to save time? Send someone else to go looking for you and pay him X-ped for his time while you were busy.

 

[Book_LBB]

hmm I am not sure.


dont put it into auction
-> have a shop directory instead

I hate running from shop to shop to search for something too
but not sure about prices etc. (similar thoughts like ace/goni) - so maybe just have a listing/Search (auction-like) where to find your item might be great.

but maybe the shopowner should be able to decide wheter the item should be displayed in the directory or not

at least that would safe time running from shop to shop without even seeing/finding the item you want, you would know which shops to go to

I think LeeLoo might be on the right track here.

To spend hours running from shop to shop trying to find a certain weapon and finding none is a pain in the arse. And if I'm spending all my time in shops I''m not out spending ped on hunting or mining.

 

[Aura Lily]

Again as in previous discussions about the real economy any basic metrics would be appreciated from MA. I am certain all transactions are or can be monitored by MA and simplistic database queries could be constructed to show the true dynamic nature of our ingame economy on an MA owned website.

There should be nothing secret secret about how peds are spent ingame.

 

[JoseMTacoral]

The idea that greater transparency runs counter the market is absolutely absurd. Quite the contrary, greater transparency would benefit the market by offering it the possibility of balancing the supply and demand with greater precision. Prices tend to balance the oferences and applicants, and fluctuations will vary according to how these factors vary and not by the transparency of information. As an additional benefit buyers avoid the surcharges based on the fraudster's own behaviors and sellers have a clear idea of how much required are their products.

 

[mastermesh]

Yes.

Yes, it's an awesome idea. Yes, it should be in the auction, although maybe there could be an option button there to either show shop items, show auction items, or show both.

Shop items would basically appear as buyout items in auction. Yes, they should have an option to buy directly from the auction for those buyers that are afriad that someone might find the stuff in shop before they can get there - perhaps a transport fee that is much, much, much smaller then the one to get to auction stuff from other shops, unless maybe the other shop is on the other planet, then normal transport fee would apply.

MA changed the way the auction worked with the sort functions, so I think they might have this in the works eventually, but to them it's probably a low priority since taming, etc. is not back yet. I wish it was a higher priority since I TTed my pet deed the other day, lol...

I DO however think that if they do this, they should make the shop not affect the auction history pricing since most shop owners price below the auction if the shop owner is active.

Everyone that keeps complaining about the overpriced items in shops are probably
- not looking outside of the malls (mall shop owners sometimes overprice since they have high rent fees, and the cost of their shops themselves were substantially higher then non-mall shops to acquire)
- not looking for normal stuff... UL Sib, and other rare items usually do have higher price tags then auction because auctions usually are for people selling out that want a fast sale, not necessarily a real sale based on the true value of the stuff in question
- not looking at all shops.
- not realizing that the real world economy is in a slump now so prices on stuff that's been sitting in some shops for months are probably based on the price the shop owner paid when they acquired the stuff.

Just because some idiot n00b came in with tons of cash, bought everything he could, and then sold it at half the price that he bought it for on the auction once he realized that this isn't the "normal" mmorpg that they are used to does not mean shop owners in the virtual universe should suffer, but many times it seems that that is exactly what happens...

Many shop owners do try to keep prices below auction prices on the history graphs. However, sometimes that's not always possible, or the stuff is below the Month, Year and Decade price but not below the day price - so people gripe as it looks like the shop price is above the day price, which is fairly silly.

If you are basing your judement on one item being sold on day price far below the year price, etc. you should really re-think how you are thinking about things.

Something else to think about - The auction lets people put in start bids at TT prices, or below that, or even on the pec level as start bids. Shop owners are stuck with a +1.02 minimum - where the +1 goes to the shop owner and 2 pecs heads to the LA owner as a tax. If you want that to change so that shops can sell to you with lower prices, talk to MA|FPC.

 

[lofwyr]

i am so shattered by the whole idea that i forgot why i was against it in the first place ... but i am - i think. i wrote it down to be safe. yes ... i'm against it. no. no way. nananaaaaah. i don't listen. nananannaaaaah. I'M SCREAMING SO LOUD YOUR WORDS DON'T REACH MY EARS LALALALAAAAHAAAHAAHA



seriously ... no

S.

PS. good that mastermesh posted already. a thread can't be complete without his/her input

 

[LeWolf86]

Would be an AWFUL idea....

As someone mentioned on 1st page... it would just cause more competition and drive prices down further... people would undercut shops because they could see shop prices... and since many people dont mind undercutting for quicker sale it will be a death to shop owners IMO...

I think a better system would be to just allow for each mall to have a shop terminal where instead of going from shop to shop or... going through a teleport to different floors... you just access the shop directory... and then you could see all listings available in the mall... or tower location etc etc... this would make it much easier for tracking down items in those locations....

Currently shop system is awful... no one likes running around to different shops only to see savings are so minimal that you rather pay 1-2PED just to have a quick purchase off auctioneer... or that you see prices are higher then auction....

But... to do the system mentioned in OP... that would mean it would just open up more information for sellers/buyers... and it would cause more undercutting where shop owners would sure be able to undercut a bit more due to no deposit (50pec) and a savings of 2.5% tax... but people would undercut them...

I think the directory option would be good and would make shops maybe at the farthest back location actually be accessible without as much trouble as it is now.... as many shops are just so far away that... its just pointless unless savings are awesome.

 

[LeeLoo Faith]

instead of going from shop to shop or... going through a teleport to different floors...

there is a televator in each mall to go from floor to floor without stairs

Currently shop system is awful... no one likes running around to different shops only to see savings are so minimal that you rather pay 1-2PED just to have a quick purchase off auctioneer... or that you see prices are higher then auction....

Its not the shop system that is awful! its the fact that 75% of the shops are empty or closed which makes it so awful running around looking.
also a directory like in RL Malls, where to find which kind of stuff would be helpful.

 

[LeWolf86]

there is a televator in each mall to go from floor to floor without stairs



Its not the shop system that is awful! its the fact that 75% of the shops are empty or closed which makes it so awful running around looking.
also a directory like in RL Malls, where to find which kind of stuff would be helpful.

Ya I agree with you, didn't read all posts before posting so missed your comment about shop directory... which would be best option...

Would be easier to have mall auction system then current system, and everyone would benefit... I just hate how shops are currently... usually its... go to the known peoples shops because you know they are open and stocked... although not always priced properly... other then the big shops most are just dead, closed, empty, junk.

 

[LeeLoo Faith]

Ya I agree with you, didn't read all posts before posting so missed your comment about shop directory... which would be best option...

Would be easier to have mall auction system then current system, and everyone would benefit... I just hate how shops are currently... usually its... go to the known peoples shops because you know they are open and stocked... although not always priced properly... other then the big shops most are just dead, closed, empty, junk.

yeah exactly :/

a directory would be cool, should maybe have name given by shop owner, short description given by shop owner, short content list (ie. Weapons, Amps, Armour..) and should show if it is open or not, along with the info where it is located. (could maybe also show number of items for sale)

 

[Deleted member 22144]

I think it would be a bad idea.
With a little effort you can find some nice prices at some shops. It would be to easy for the resellers and there won't be so much nice deals anymore.

 

[mastermesh]

But... to do the system mentioned in OP... that would mean it would just open up more information for sellers/buyers... and it would cause more undercutting where shop owners would sure be able to undercut a bit more due to no deposit (50pec) and a savings of 2.5% tax... but people would undercut them...

The info is already opened up wide for sellers/buyers. Most resellers probably already look at shops when figuring their prices. Actually, I suspect that quite a few buy from the shops to do the reselling at Twin, which is part of the reason so many resellers love Twin and PA.

As long as they are there, they are giving people that rely on them illusion that the options are to buy from them or the malls there... The malls are mostly overpriced there, except for a few shops, but the shops elsewhere are not necessarily as pricey as the mall shops... Even some of the mall shops are resold. Can't tell you how many times I've seen Ghost at PA mall being resold on auction at +1 or more...

Sure there would be some undercutting, but it would all stabilize eventually, and really put prices where the need to really be.

PS. good that mastermesh posted already. a thread can't be complete without his/her input

Now you can consider this thread fully complete since I've posted more then once, lol.

 

[Naithen]

At the first sight it sounds good, but ...

if you take a closer look, then you should know that most shopowners (those who operate working shops) set prices slightly below auction prices.

This will lead to lower prices from auction traders, as they will start to offer below the shop offers.

I couldnt disagree more because i found myself in this situation just the other day, i was looking to buy a new fap so i checked auction and then went around to a couple Malls and what i found was faps over priced and alot of closed shops. The first thing i thought after i bought my fap from auction was "what a waist of time" it was looking through the ghost town Malls "and i wont be doing it again anytime soon"! And then i thought "they should all be connected to the Auction"! Atleast that way the shop owners would have noticed prices had fallen and they could adjust thier price.If i was MA i would make it easier on Mall and Shop owners to make a living NOT more difficult!But no they even put the auction in the mall so you can see how over priced the shop owner is I dont mind going to the mall to pick up an item i bought at auction maybe that would create more atmosphere in the malls.

 

[shoti]

looking just at poll opinions are perfectly devided 39 vs 39, but mostly ppl against are posting why.

as for undercuting prices...info about price is not causing price lower by itself. ppl starting sales are decidents of that.

 

[Ancient]

If it hasnt been said already, I dont think that shops should be linked with the auction, but I do beleive that each shopping mall should have its own seperate auction, to make it easier to find things.

 

[Talania]

I think it would be okay to link it if the prices are not part of the link, just the location.

Already talked to an FPC avatar in Twin Peaks about this a few months ago.

 

[LeWolf86]

looking just at poll opinions are perfectly devided 39 vs 39, but mostly ppl against are posting why.

as for undercuting prices...info about price is not causing price lower by itself. ppl starting sales are decidents of that.

Well by info we mean that I can look at auction organize by lowest price and then if I want a quick sale... toss mine up for 1ped under the lowest available... this is what would happen if shops were intergrated into auction which would then result in shops in being just a cheaper auction tool.... which would be kinda good in a way... but chances are shops wouldn't be offering cheaper then auction anymore by much... just the lowest price... and eventually people would undercut shops etc etc.... at least until supplies dry up and prices go up .

 

[Talania]

Well by info we mean that I can look at auction organize by lowest price and then if I want a quick sale... toss mine up for 1ped under the lowest available... this is what would happen if shops were intergrated into auction which would then result in shops in being just a cheaper auction tool.... which would be kinda good in a way... but chances are shops wouldn't be offering cheaper then auction anymore by much... just the lowest price... and eventually people would undercut shops etc etc.... at least until supplies dry up and prices go up .

That is why there should be a separate section on the auction for Malls, booths that only lists locations.

 

[Atraie]

Shops are too annoying to use. You can spend hours looking for an item to walk away with nothing but wasted time.

Id love a shop directory(an UP TO DATE one...) that told me what each shop sold. I dont even need prices. I just want to know who is selling item XXX before wasting 2 hours checking each shop manually.

Just an in game directory is all i want. Shopkeepers are paying taxes on the stuff, they should at least get something for it!

 

[shoti]

indeed i meant sometihng like using actualy existing auction as "shop directory". As i writed in 1st post whole idea is to not have possibility to buy from shops via auction ( bo at auction and personal walk to retirive maybe )