If you are tired about low sweat price, please read this and join me. If not, don't read please.

GradenFoss

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5) Take away the autouse function for the VSE Tool. People would get sick of clicking and would not want to do it for hours upon hours.
Well... that was what sweating was like up to VU10, right? And we did sweat anyway in those days. :sweat:
 

Farmer Smurf

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Well... that was what sweating was like up to VU10, right? And we did sweat anyway in those days. :sweat:
In fact so many people used a auto clicker, that one could argue MA gave up the fight and built it into the game (auto tool)

It's still on a very little scale, since we are still only 3 and don't spend a lot of time doing this, but, because less sweat is actually gathered : For now, this is working. Well, for seeing anything impact on the price, well.. we must have to wait for a little time.

I appreciate all the ideas proposed by many of you, but since it is not something we can actually DO, I won't answer on these matters: MA will do what they want to.

Just a little update about the "you will be banned" thing : From what I see, for now, I haven't been banned, and I come almost everyday. 3 or 4 people said that they have reported me, and I've heard nothing from MA nor from these people since then. (EDIT : I haven't been banned, and I haven't been warned either !)
I do hope you realize it takes MA a few weeks or even months to get around to banning people. they are slow as with all things, but its very likly to happen and the more support tickets raised against you the more likely it will happen.

Also you could stop the input of sweat completely from every single avatar everywhere and it would take about a year to remove all the sweat that is in STORAGE lol I personally know not 1 but 3 people with more than a million units in storage, and I do not know many people.
 
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Draxar

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I do hope you realize it takes MA a few weeks or even months to get around to banning people. they are slow as with all things, but its very likly to happen and the more support tickets raised against you the more likely it will happen.
Oh, I did not realize that, since they always usually process my support tickets very quickly.
Well, all in all, I don't really see where the truth ends and where you opinion begins, especially in that sentence : "the more support tickets raised against you the more likely it will happen." ... IMO, that doesn't seem a fair system.. When MA is aware about a situation and decides to judge it, I don't understand why 5, 10, or 100 other support tickets would change anything: an action is legal or not, and that's it. (and 100 people don't represent a noticeable part of the total players anyway, that could just be 100 selfish players, annoyed by the most little thing.. I don't know how to put it more clearly in english)
In that system, a very famous character could ask, by anger/jealousy/etc.., his 100 friends to send support tickets against the same avatar with no reason.

That's why I think the only problem is : Is the reason of the report valid ? And not the number of reports..
(OK, I understand that many reports will probably make MA care more about a problem.. only in that way, I agree with you, even if I don't think that it automatically means that I would more likely be banned)
But, well, anyway, I'll update here as soon as I hear news from MA about it.


And, really, none of us can tell if dragging a mob on a sweat group in a private area can seriously be seen as "interfering with other's gameplay"... I'll try to explain the best as I can why I consider that it shouldn't :

1) First of all, sweating is not like hunting : no risk of losing PED. I fully understand that killing a hunter with mobs in a non-pvp area can be consider as "interfering", as I call that harassment. Same thing as dragging 100 mobs on players trying to trade in PA. sweating is not like trading either : sweating is a dangerous activity, you can die while doing it and you know it while doing it, and there is absolutely NO loss.

2) Being killed while sweating is the.. normal way of sweating a L37 mob. The fact that players decided to sweat in group is not something offered by MA. If I decide not to join them, that's unfair to me, and I feel that I can decide to keep them from sweating in group. It's just player actions against player actions(, with no PED lost). that is an insincere point of view, I just want to make things as clear as possible, and I must exaggerate a bit, but I hope that you get the point: I just feel that I try to cancel something which doesn't concern MA.

3) Nea's Place is owned by a player. (I engage on a slippery slope here, since I don't really know what it implies) I don't know exactly what that owner can do, but I guess he decided to put these ambus here, to make this land a non-pvp area. And in a way, I feel like MA is not responsible for what happens here between the mobs and the players.
(2+3 makes MA very unconcerned with that problem IMO, since they doesnt seem to be concerned about sweat at all)

4) You may think it is paradoxical, and I do too, but I wouldn't mobtrain 200 mobs with a vehicle on the sweaters, I would call that harassment. But I'm not even sure about it.. because of all of the above, the location, etc..
 

Farmer Smurf

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Oh, I did not realize that, since they always usually process my support tickets very quickly.
MA responds quickly with canned responses. anything else often requires some time, especially when they leave the offices for summer vacation (holiday).

Well, all in all, I don't really see where the truth ends and where you opinion begins, especially in that sentence : "the more support tickets raised against you the more likely it will happen." ... IMO, that doesn't seem a fair system.. a very famous character could ask, by anger/jealousy/etc.., his 100 friends to send support tickets against the same avatar with no reason.
True, and when MA investigates they would see no reason, however if they look through your logs and see you purposefully messing with others "fun" on a frequent basis..Those players requesting you to stop, and your continued abuse of their time...I am not sure your "fairness" has merit.

That's why I think the only problem is : Is the reason of the report valid ?
And, really, none of us can tell if dragging a mob on a sweat group in a private area can seriously be seen as "interfering with other's gameplay"...

1) First of all, sweating is not like hunting : no risk of losing PED.
No where in the rule "no interfering with others gameplay" does it say, only if it costs them ped...regardless many sweaters wear armor or heal, and the increased decay and heal required to fix your "harassment" would in fact fall under loss of ped..

you could be right, MA may choose not to care one way or the other what your doing...why not send them a support case, linking to this thread and ask them if what your doing is allowed or not? at least then you will know.
 

Shard-Angel

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I have been hearing reports from few people that 2 avatars have been mob-training at Nea's for the past few days. (I report this since mob-training is considered illegal by MA.)

They are BOTH named: BORN (full names are undisclosed).
** Since both have same name, it looks like a DELIBERATE attempt to sabotage the sweating process
** There is most likely the same person behind it.
** It is highly likely that these avatars were created solely for this purpose (so banning wont affect the real avatar behind it.)

I cannot disclose the full names due to forum policy, however, since they run around with their full names hidden, here is a hint: Ek***** De***** Born, and Da*** Dr**** Born (which incidently is the OP).
 

Draxar

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Blah blah blah
Have you read anything above..? Yes, actions are deliberate. After that, YOU can call them "sabotage" as much as you want, but it's not very mature to highlight these wrong points of view as if they were true. (They will be if MA decides they are; and, no, in that situation, it is not 100% clear that there was an identical precedent ever).

your post is half wrong, and half slander (and with 0% argument). If I was as immature as you, I would say "I don't even bother to answer to posts like this" but I won't :

real facts: (not MY point of view)
*******our full names are clearly known by many people in Nea's Place (lol@ I don't disclose names, but I give you a little hint)
*******my avatar hasn't been created just to do this, since it was created in 2004 (sometimes, reading all the thread can keep from talking rubbish)
*******have you ever considered that having the same Last Name can mean that we are related to each other in a way and had the idea of taking the same name for that reason ? (no, off course; since I do something you don't like, I'm a cheater and I'm evil)
*******To put it in your way : It is very likely that you don't know anything about me but that you pretend to anyway.
(Look, i've put more stars, so I'm obviously right !)

I don't usually answer in that way, but that post was really offensive. I really hope it will be deleted BTW.
Thank you for not answering back.



Farmer Smurf, I've got your point.. But, really, now, all we can do is wait and see what MA says.. I hope I'll get a chance to be heard by them. I was really into asking them myself the question at the beginning.. Now that reports have been filled, I think I'll just wait. I've talked about it a bit in reports I've sent after having being harassed lately, and they didn't seem to pay any attention about it..
 

In Love With

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Have you read anything above..? Yes, actions are deliberate. After that, YOU can call them "sabotage" as much as you want, but it's not very mature to highlight these wrong points of view as if they were true. (They will be if MA decides they are; and, no, in that situation, it is not 100% clear that there was an identical precedent ever).

your post is half wrong, and half slander (and with 0% argument). If I was as immature as you, I would say "I don't even bother to answer to posts like this" but I won't :

real facts: (not MY point of view)
*******our full names are clearly known by many people in Nea's Place (lol@ I don't disclose names, but I give you a little hint)
*******my avatar hasn't been created just to do this, since it was created in 2004 (sometimes, reading all the thread can keep from talking rubbish)
*******have you ever considered that having the same Last Name can mean that we are related to each other in a way and had the idea of taking the same name for that reason ? (no, off course; since I do something you don't like, I'm a cheater and I'm evil)
*******To put it in your way : It is very likely that you don't know anything about me but that you pretend to anyway.
(Look, i've put more stars, so I'm obviously right !)

I don't usually answer in that way, but that post was really offensive. I really hope it will be deleted BTW.
Thank you for not answering back.



Farmer Smurf, I've got your point.. But, really, now, all we can do is wait and see what MA says.. I hope I'll get a chance to be heard by them. I was really into asking them myself the question at the beginning.. Now that reports have been filled, I think I'll just wait. I've talked about it a bit in reports I've sent after having being harassed lately, and they didn't seem to pay any attention about it..
Just fucking deposit ... Seriously, if you had spent half the time working vs. posting useless ideas here you could have easily deposited 1000 ped already. Is there any point to this dribble ??

Gee, sweating is for new people to initially get to know the game, its not meant to make money.

just my 2 cents

Angel
 

Draxar

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Just fucking deposit ... Seriously, if you had spent half the time working vs. posting useless ideas here you could have easily deposited 1000 ped already. Is there any point to this dribble ??

Gee, sweating is for new people to initially get to know the game, its not meant to make money.

just my 2 cents

Angel
Sorry, I don't think that the most important thing in life is MONEY... thanks anyway for your advice, because it could be useful to some other people here !
 

Draxar

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EDIT: and, I must add... 99% of what I do here is answering to other ideas (useless or not); I've only posted ONE idea, and asked some questions at the beginning.

Erk, I haven't edited but doubleposted... wrong button, sorry. I don't know if I can delete this.
 

Casper

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I and my Socmates have moved to a new/unused area to collect Vibrant Sweat.
It is far more efficent than Neas...ammost 50% more per hour.
I thank you for your efforts as they have forced a change for the better for us. More sweat...more peds.
I will continue to skill healing at Neas as I loot spare chips...you are actually helping me in that too.
Funny how bad things can be turned into good despite your best laid evil plans...
 

Draxar

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I and my Socmates have moved to a new/unused area to collect Vibrant Sweat.
It is far more efficent than Neas...ammost 50% more per hour.
I thank you for your efforts as they have forced a change for the better for us. More sweat...more peds.
I will continue to skill healing at Neas as I loot spare chips...you are actually helping me in that too.
Funny how bad things can be turned into good despite your best laid evil plans...
Good for you Casper !
If you read correctly, I don't plan on doing something that I consider bad.. If you make more PED now, it's really good for you ! (I'm not being sarcastic)
 

Uvas

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Good for you Casper !
If you read correctly, I don't plan on doing something that I consider bad.. If you make more PED now, it's really good for you ! (I'm not being sarcastic)
But according to you it must be bad...they are making MORE sweat. Exactly what you are trying to stop with your mobtrains and whatnot...
 

Draxar

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But according to you it must be bad...they are making MORE sweat. Exactly what you are trying to stop with your mobtrains and whatnot...
yep ! I've never said the opposite..

BTW, please, can someone define me "mobtraining" ?? I mean, clearly !

In my thoughts, mobtraining was dragging a very important amount of mobs at the same time on a player/group of players.. Was I wrong ?
 

wizzszz

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Can't you just let this disgrace of a thread rest in peace? :locked:


Seriously, what's the point in bringing this up again and again... and again... and again? :scratch2:
 

Uvas

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It's just like bringing up a non-existant "personal loot pool" again and again and again....

Some people just don't know when to let things go, I guess.
 

Draxar

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Can't you just let this disgrace of a thread rest in peace? :locked:


Seriously, what's the point in bringing this up again and again... and again... and again? :scratch2:
Hey, don't read if you're not interested! When people talk to me, I answer ; and sometimes I ask questions, especially when I don't know what they mean exactly.
I've answered only to half the things that have been said..

I "uped" that thread once for news, and maybe I'll do it only once more, since I've finally gotten a beginning of an answer from MA...

But by saying that kind of things using that tone, you obviously make me post once more. Think about it : don't tell me anything, and I won't answer.
 

mastermesh

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so many bumps, I decided to send my own support ticket in yesterday...
2012-08-06 16:12 Entropia Universe Support:

Hi mastermesh,

Thank you for contacting us. Yes this doesn't look good at all, we'll investigate further and take proper action.

Thank you for your report,
Cameron | Planet Calypso Support
My suggestion, change your ways before you get banned.
 

Nisha

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BTW, please, can someone define me "mobtraining" ?? I mean, clearly !

In my thoughts, mobtraining was dragging a very important amount of mobs at the same time on a player/group of players.. Was I wrong ?

I doubt there is an official definition for that.

Usually it does mean pulling a considerable number of mobs from their original spawn to another place (e. g. the Argo mobtrains in Twin).





However, when players send support cases the most important factor is how much the action interferes with their game play. - For a sweater one additional Ambulimax disrupts the sweating process, two or three can mess up a sweating session for a whole group.

You can drag mobtrains across the planet all day long as long as you do not really mess with someone else's game. And I know a number of players who enjoy ending up in an occasional mobtrain just for the fun of it.

However, aggroing single mobs repeatedly on other players with the intent to interfere with their game play is likely to get you just the same tickets as someone who does a number of "real" mobtrains.
 

K-Max

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MA tried by introducing Welding Wire and a few other BPs that require sweat, but the BPs are plentiful. And small amounts of welding wire, 5 ped let's say, last for a good long while. Which helped decrease the demand for sweat.
There are tons of BP's in game actually now that take sweat. 2 weeks ago I ground down 50k sweat making lesser elysia (NI BP) while looking for bp drops in clothing on Arkadia.

NI and RT have sweat mixed into loads of other BP's as well.

Sweat just is a free commodity in the game and it's life as a cash cow is over. Move on find a new revenue when everyone moves on figures out other things to do in game sweat will once again rise hopefully. Sweating is more a social activity then a cash revenue activity since I started playing. I moved on because ya know what making .02 USD a day for 8 hours work just is not worth it when I can be out losing 30 USD per day hunting and mining :D
 

Uvas

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Get over what?

Didn't care for the comparison?
 

Draxar

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as promised, an update, now that the situation is "over" for now. I've received a response from MA, which is quite surprising and interesting IMO, since noone here has seen that coming :

"The most important issue here is the intention to manipulate the market, which is a serious matter for us since EU is based on a real cash economy.
Your account has been unlocked, but we must ask you to stop this behavior. If you continue to do so you risk having your account permanently banned.
"


that's interesting, because many of you were half right / half wrong.. It's too long to search the names of all the people in that thread who can be corrected by that answer, but let's summarize :

1)You CAN'T manipulate the sweat market. Not because it's not possible, but because it's not legal (which tend to prove it's possible).
2)What I've been doing wasn't mobtraining after all (I insist on that, because many here (and at Nea's) were VERY confident with their good right of doing the good deed of talking to me like cr*p because of that false reason)
3)trying to manipulate the market is wrong. That absolutely must be told to these players wanting to create Sweat Unions and stuff (I've never seen them warned in that way by anybody)


Well, that isn't finished, because it raises many questions about what is legal and what is not and I'll ask them.
But this thread certainly is finished, since I can't ask anymore people to join me. Thanks for your attention, even if some of you could chill a little before posting, that would help to maintain a peaceful and constructive ambiance with no threats, patronizing, offenses.. (well, I'm dreaming). Because some of you here made a REALLY big deal out of that little thing.

If some people are interested, I'll PM them what happens next with the support service, because I think that this is the only thing that really matters : what it can teach to us (if I'm not the only one interested and quite confused with their answer)
 
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OZtwo

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If some people are interested, I'll PM them what happens next with the support service, because I think that this is the only thing that really matters : what it can teach to us (if I'm not the only one interested and quite confused with their answer)
You got banned for training mobs into groups of new users trying to sweat for the first time? :) It would be best to just let it go man :) Just deposit and you will be happy.
 

Nisha

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"The most important issue here is the intention to manipulate the market, which is a serious matter for us since EU is based on a real cash economy.
Your account has been unlocked, but we must ask you to stop this behavior. If you continue to do so you risk having your account permanently banned.
"

...

1)You CAN'T manipulate the sweat market. Not because it's not possible, but because it's not legal (which tend to prove it's possible).
2)What I've been doing wasn't mobtraining after all (I insist on that, because many here (and at Nea's) were VERY confident with their good right of doing the good deed of talking to me like cr*p because of that false reason)
3)trying to manipulate the market is wrong. That absolutely must be told to these players wanting to create Sweat Unions and stuff (I've never seen them warned in that way by anybody)
I suggest you read the MA reply carefully.

They said the *most* important issue, and I certainly agree that this point is more important than any other discussed here.

Why do you think that noone expected a ban for market manipulation? - If someone reported your behavior for that rather than for disrupting their game play, I'm not surprised at all.

Btw, they did not say that you were not mobtraining. They simply did not address this point, which is something completely different. They only addressed the most important issue, now it is up to you to figure out what the other issues could be.
 

Draxar

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(well, I'll continue to answer to people anyway)

You got banned for training mobs into groups of new users trying to sweat for the first time? :) It would be best to just let it go man :) Just deposit and you will be happy.
No I didn't get banned.. You should read the thread, I won't answer since everything can easily be understood by reading it carefully.
The rest is off-topic, but I keep in mind not to PM you about this matter! (for the others : it is most necessary to tell me if you WANT news rather than if you don't..)


I suggest you read the MA reply carefully.

They said the *most* important issue, and I certainly agree that this point is more important than any other discussed here.

Why do you think that noone expected a ban for market manipulation? - If someone reported your behavior for that rather than for disrupting their game play, I'm not surprised at all.

Btw, they did not say that you were not mobtraining. They simply did not address this point, which is something completely different. They only addressed the most important issue, now it is up to you to figure out what the other issues could be.
My bad... I haven't CCed the whole discussion with the support.. : The reports were totally about mobtraining (which is about LARGE amounts of mobs, as they've told me), it is the reason my account has been locked, and I've been told that if inquiries had shown such a behavior, I would have been permanently banned.
After that, I asked for clarification, since I've never manipulated large amounts of mobs, and that answer comes at the end of my locked account period.
Since the notion of "issue" does not imply any guilt, I assume that I've been cleared on the point of mobtraining because I haven't been banned and because they don't address this point, since it was the reason of the lock in the first place. But I will ask more clarity on that point anyway, so I won't have to assume anything.

I realize that without the whole discussion with the support, it was unclear.. It's complicated to explain, so I hope this is more clear now.
 

Uvas

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I have a question.

Was what you posted the entire reply from support?

If not, can you post the whole thing?
 

Farmer Smurf

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So they locked the account while they investigated, and then told you to stop your behavior, and unlocked you?

I am happy to hear that, its good that MA would communicate with you, and give you the chance to stop.. and not just perma-lock your account.

I too would be interested in the whole CS post. if you have no problem with full disclosure.

As for "The most important issue here is the intention to manipulate the market,"

they never said its possible to manipulate sweat market, It could very well be impossibe...and if you still have "intent" to do it, then your doing it...even if you /fail at it. perhaps one way to read that anyway..
 
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starcollector

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Hy so we can not sell our sweat....hm let use to create items from sweat we gather (no need to buy) only to sell the item crafted....The sweat is used in some blueprints in some planets..i know some blueprints who need sweat from entropedia but this site is not always uptaded by players so I want you(other players to help me) to add info about blueprints that use sweat :) thank you


Ill start to post what i know

Next Island

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=2397

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=2453

Rocktropia

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=1687

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=1674

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=1669

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=2255

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=1684

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=1675

http://www.entropiawiki.com/Info.aspx?chart=Blueprint&id=2273

if someone else has info about blueprints that use sweat please add info on entropedia or here ty :)
 

Samuel Robet

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I am currently buying sweat

1700 -1730 Ma Time every wednesday
@ emerald Lakes mall, floor 2 shop 7s
paying: 1.95/k

0800-0830 MA time every Sunday
@ Deer Mall, Floor 1 Shop 1
Paying: 1.95/k
 
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