Is it Deposits, or Cycled PEDs....

[ermik]

just my opinion.....the system knows that you have looted 800 of item, but if you do not sell them (aka transform into peds) the system rewards you better

I think this is because you cannot use those item in generaly to hunt, cannot user oils to hunt and so on

Anyway, have fun spending a lot of money and enjoy that ATH when it arives

i just try and understand how such a complex system would be coded , imo the system is easy , to ensure full functionality and small chances of flaws.

what you are describing is a nightmare to code , if even possible.

 

[Jimmy B]

There have been many theories over the years that say that your Global ratio (and indeed loot in general) is directly related to your deposits....

Others have thought that it's cycled PEDs that make the difference.

All the successful non-depositors know which of those options is correct.

 

[WoenK]

From my experience the "cycling" is not just the materials,ammo and decay, but also what you "cycle" on auction and trade like a "social" variable.
Also the system has a tendency to rather repay you faster if you change activities, camping can be rewarding if done long enough, but sometimes it pays to do some crafting and mining in between and force a return faster.
In the end, it does not matter how many globals you you get, but only how much your return rate is.
If it's below 90% after cycling 20k, than you are probably not hunting at your level (where level is not solely defined by skills, but also gear used).
Another variable might be how much you have to cycle according to your level.
I think one must cycle more the more one levels up to get the same effect as at lower levels, never tried chipping out, but seems like those that did where a bit happier with their loot returns.

Andi if a deposit really helps...I know that the times when I got desperate and could not deposit, but cleared out my starage instead, it had the same effect like a deposit. The moment you have enough PEDs to cycle through a bad period, it ends faster. If you are on a tight budget or none at all, it can take months until you get close to your investments (not counting stupid things like hunting un-eco with oversized guns).

 

[GradenFoss]

Eve Damsel Online
Rapture of Rebellion
Resource mined: Narcanisum Stone
Value of resources: 37135 PED
Date of entry: 2011-09-26 18:51:40

What means those last three animated faces?

Three quite amused cheeseballs.

 

[Cail]

Well, i've heard these "90% returns" exist.
And i've been keeping this mining log for almost 40 days, not long granted, cycled 51k peds, and it's starting to even out at 80% TT returns and closing in on 90% markup returns, that is, what i get from other players.
Just might be something to it, that they track your deposits too and only give you 90% of what you actually put in (conspiracy!).

Evil bastards.

PS. now get your ass back in line and forget 'bout your TV

 

[valentin]

Well, i've heard these "90% returns" exist.
And i've been keeping this mining log for almost 40 days, not long granted, cycled 51k peds, and it's starting to even out at 80% TT returns and closing in on 90% markup returns, that is, what i get from other players.
Just might be something to it, that they track your deposits too and only give you 90% of what you actually put in (conspiracy!).

Evil bastards.

PS. now get your ass back in line and forget 'bout your TV

No,no... If you are a hunter you only getting back 90% of the TT ammo you spent nothing else.
All the damige you do on your armor,fap and weapons and so on is a profit to MA.
So MA is first taking 10% of your money of the TT on ammo and then about 10-15% of all dmg you are getting so you are losing about 20-25% of your money al the time ( for a player with normal gears ) if you are not lucky or have a special agreement with MA.

 

[Xavier_Jr]

No,no... If you are a hunter you only getting back 90% of the TT ammo you spent nothing else.
All the damige you do on your armor,fap and weapons and so on is a profit to MA.
So MA is first taking 10% of your money of the TT on ammo and then about 10-15% of all dmg you are getting so you are losing about 20-25% of your money al the time ( for a player with normal gears ) if you are not lucky or have a special agreement with MA.

What you say sounds reasonable, considering that the measurements and percentiles from Falkao table was made based solely on mining. But decay of mining tools is negligible.

 

[Cail]

No,no... If you are a hunter you only getting back 90% of the TT ammo you spent nothing else.
All the damige you do on your armor,fap and weapons and so on is a profit to MA.
So MA is first taking 10% of your money of the TT on ammo and then about 10-15% of all dmg you are getting so you are losing about 20-25% of your money al the time ( for a player with normal gears ) if you are not lucky or have a special agreement with MA.

I was speaking of mining there on my post, i know of hunting and i do waaaay worse in it.

What you say sounds reasonable, considering that the measurements and percentiles from Falkao table was made based solely on mining. But decay of mining tools is negligible.

You may say that the decay of them tools is negligble, Ace did his experiment and i remember a line from there "returns are proportional to finder decay"

 

[ermik]

No,no... If you are a hunter you only getting back 90% of the TT ammo you spent nothing else.
All the damige you do on your armor,fap and weapons and so on is a profit to MA.
So MA is first taking 10% of your money of the TT on ammo and then about 10-15% of all dmg you are getting so you are losing about 20-25% of your money al the time ( for a player with normal gears ) if you are not lucky or have a special agreement with MA.

id say short term yes , but some of the tt spent on weapon,amp builds up for future hofs.

if ammo is the only thing counted as tt in , how about melee weapons?

 

[Karmic]

This thread has turned into straight up misinformation. Yes, if you do things like mine amped on FOMA you will normally get less than 90% TT return, but that is the return you chose to get in return for the chance of hitting "the big one". 90% TT back on ammo only and 75% over long term is absurd and not born out on any test I've ever seen. Regular hunting on lower end mobs like drones efficiently for me is around 95% return including weapon decay and amp decay after about 10,000 mobs. However, very low end mobs like merp turn out lower even unarmored.

It's also interesting how once again people throw the uber loots out of the calculations. Like calculating the return on a video poker machine but ignoring the royal flush payout.

 

[Soradin]

This thread has turned into straight up misinformation. Yes, if you do things like mine amped on FOMA you will normally get less than 90% TT return, but that is the return you chose to get in return for the chance of hitting "the big one". 90% TT back on ammo only and 75% over long term is absurd and not born out on any test I've ever seen. Regular hunting on lower end mobs like drones efficiently for me is around 95% return including weapon decay and amp decay after about 10,000 mobs. However, very low end mobs like merp turn out lower even unarmored.

It's also interesting how once again people throw the uber loots out of the calculations. Like calculating the return on a video poker machine but ignoring the royal flush payout.

Yea...

Jimmy B's post reminded me of things I had forgotten... primarily the folks who don't deposit who still do well.

So that actually took care of my initial post.

I'm pretty much of a mind that I'm probably not going to see a real HOF myself... at least not anytime in the near future. I don't have the huge weapons, or the huge armor. My skills aren't that good really due to all the vacations and the fact that I was never really a "skill goal" type player (maybe a little over 50k right now, but I'm working on it)... I don't hunt through thousands of PEDs a day... and honestly so much has changed since the last time I was around for more than a month or two (2008) i'm learning a lot over again.

Of course I want to see a real HOF (I've been on the board twice, both times after the list reset ), or get a nice item..... but right now I'll just be happy getting back the returns I'm seeing hunting conservatively and enjoying the time with my wife.

 

[Karmic]

I'm pretty much of a mind that I'm probably not going to see a real HOF myself... at least not anytime in the near future. I don't have the huge weapons, or the huge armor.

If your goal is really to get a HoF over 3k or so the best way to do it is to kill a lot of small mobs instead of a few large mobs. You have a lot more chances at a 3k tantillion than you do killing the same health value of Atrox Stalkers.

 

[Soradin]

If your goal is really to get a HoF over 3k or so the best way to do it is to kill a lot of small mobs instead of a few large mobs. You have a lot more chances at a 3k tantillion than you do killing the same health value of Atrox Stalkers.

I wouldn't call it a goal....

Well, maybe I would. 3k? LOL.. I'll be shocked if we ever break 253 PED (our highest loot ever, from back in 2008).

Right now, we've decided the best thing for us to to is hunt economically, and take care of some iron challenges. I'm about 2500 into the 5k Shinkiba one, almost done with 1k Argos, and we have several of the others (Corns, Feffs, Molisk, Merp) at the 1k level and moving up. We've invested (I really do consider it an investment) in unlimited SIB weapons for those too so we don't have to keep paying markup on (L) weapons.... I really hate buying limited anything. I even use my MF chip for healing instead of buying FAPs.

Now and then we take a break, hunt something big like Drone Coordinators as part of the Robot Invasion with purchased (L) weapons (LR53 for me), or maybe just some Troopers, or something with our Society just cause we've always liked blowing up drones, and we might as well use that Vigi we have now and then.

 

[lyosha]

After ~5 days, also after unlocking my Serendipity skill I have got a 8059 HOF from LEVI

sorry to be off topic but:
i hit 14,666ped uber about 2 days after unlocking serendipidy, my buddy MiniM hit a 10+k streak on levi after unlocking serendipidy, and just resently one of my diciples unlocked it and on her third kill after unlock hit 800ped drone. =)

sorry to be off topic =D

 

[Leona]

Is it Deposits, or Cycled PEDs....

Neither. High loots are usually the somewhat delayed result of an certain play style. Deposits and Peds cycled matter only as in that you can hardly play agressive without having some funds and turnover.

Extraordinary loots are, for the most part, a result of extraordinary ignorance. And i don't use the term ignorance here in the sense of 'lack of knowledge' but in the sense of being 'capable' to ignore.

The system pretty much adjust to what the player wants, or rather what the system infers the player wants based on his actions. One can adjust loot volatility with several methods. Of course it didn't take long for players to realize and abuse it in example to 'prepare' for highest single loot events.
Also the introducion of super high TT unlimited SIB items in loot, ESIs with TT value etc. changed the (perceived) potential value of high TT loots. So MindArk had to adjust and extend the delay and randomisation of the delay between cause and effect.

Nowadays we are at a point where this maskerade goes so far that the connection between cause and effect is often, if not mostly, beyond the attention span of the average person.

This is what people really complain about when they complain about large loots. Nobody minds big loots, most don't even mind if they observe that some other people always seem to get the big loots. What people do mind is when the experience is massively 'stretched'. Human nature, except for the most resilient ones, demands timely gratification.

This is also why it is very hard today to teach the value of an economical play style to new players. Good education not only relies on fact teaching but in example also by showing the impact of something on something else.

If the new player goes out and hunts small creatures with an short term 75% return it is very hard to explain why the few percent he can gain by selling his loot smarter and using the right setup is all he needs to be long term succesfull.
Blinded by large HOFs from small creatures scrolling by in the chat window most people fall back to an religious perception of the loot system instead of rational observation. Treading your in game profession like an real life profession is hard when the time span between your actions and the results is so long.

The concept of the term average is not inherent to the human mind, superstition is. In lack of knowledge how something works we all often fall back to superstition. At the rate loot volatility increased in EU superstition raised its ugly head.

There was an time in EU where wrong actions resulted in an observable and timely slap on the wrist. Right actions always took a bit longer but at least the effect was timely observable and one was able to connect. Of course even at that time a lot of people choose to ignore, but for the most part most of us role played superstitious.

Just recently one thread and one blog post lead me to read everything a person posted on this forum about 'lucky flagged' avatars. It is higly interessting how unopposed those posts jump from conclusion to conclusion and try to present it as facts. Even the most basic facts about the avatars he uses as examples are verifiable wrong. But no one cares anymore, the ones who know better are to tired to react, an other part of the readers just jump on every boat that helps them to ignore the own shortcomings.

Back to the real topic. One can turn over millions of peds without an extraordinary high loot and one can also force large loots with compareable less turnover. It is really not so much about how much you turn over but about how agressive you turn it over. Of course the effect most often does not happen at the activitiy you would want it or when you want it. Would be too easy this way... In fact i personally fucked up on every single occasion i did this in my EU life.

 

[Agis]

Been reading this thread and its interesting points.

For one im like valentin , I have had really bad luck and I have deposited about 22,000USD (into hunting - I have hardly any gear, since jan 2008 , for the record ive cycled ~5.3 million ped in that time in TT, I always have used the best i have been able to get even if i had to pay MU for thie items.

I used XT from SIB at level 66 right through to now, also used Felis, Customised Kan G2 x 2, Geotrek Kisf, Isis BL1600, HL20, Uti, Saou, CB29.. in Jan 2008 i was using X5 all are L. Got my delta SGA up to tier 5 and now renting a unique powerful gun, Whatever the best L gun for my level, I use , I always use enhancers and always use EAMP 15 or Evil.

I am really poor in Real Life, I live on a disabled pension and have a weekend market stall i sell stuff to deposit PED ingame. I never really have gone more than a few months without actually depositing knowing that my investment will be returned. I have tried to achieve getting a loots to get back my investment, I know the system pays back 90% in all TT you spend and I always work on that setup,

There are many lucky avatars that never deposit or havent deposited in a long time, pavo, das, gorro, BD, skippie, SLOE, Alin, minime, Charon, Laban etc..

I see that luck is always there on some of those avatars, How is it that Alin gets a 1kped ESI and everyone else on Sand King (almost 50 avatars) get nothing. I have a feeling that there are 'gold flagged' avatars that always get good loot, and everyday i turnover thousands of ped and nothing comes of Age , maybe one day i may become 'gold flagged' but i feel alot more hard work and dedication is needed , and also valentin you and mike powers deserve to join the 'gold flagged' avatars as do I, we all work extremely hard and get so little in return and we are all in the top 50 all time hunters. Laban has finally been flagged m maybe us 3 will get flagged to succeed one day.

Its not the cycle, its not the deposits - its whether you become one of those 'gifted' avatars, get MAs attention that your here to play seriously and you maybe get noticed. Im sure 5.3 million cycled would have given me a better loot by now (and thats not including how much i cycled in 2006 and 2007)

have a look at my signature that was may 2008

This is now

37. Agis Agis Mckracken 4467 731,595 PEDs

mining

96. Agis Agis Mckracken 1081 153,559.00 PEDs

My Highest Loots
23,633 PED Kreltin Young 5/29/2009 (Customised Kanerium G2 + Eamp 15)
18,999 PED Atrox Young 4/20/2011 (XT + evil)
16,834 PED Ambulimax Young 11/7/2010 (Frean D delta SGA + bull tac 50 T5)
12,480 PED Proteron Old 2/16/2010 (Geotrek Kisf + evil)
7,803 PED Vulcan Drake Old Alpha 3/23/2011 (XT + evil)
3,016 PED Atrax Stalker 8/11/2010 (Adapted Mong, Anabolic and Eamp 15)
2,860 PED Vulcan Drake Stalker 12/16/2010 (Bl1600 + evil)
2,814 PED Vulcan Drake Stalker 3/16/2011 (XT + evil)
6,448 PED Iron Stone 5/18/2011 (Level 8 Amp)
6,383 PED Gazzurdite Stone 5/18/2011 (Level 8 Amp)
6,355 PED Caldorite Stone 5/8/2011 (OA 105)
3,324 PED Caldorite Stone 11/12/2010 (OA 105)
2,156 PED Melchi Water 10/26/2011 (Level 5 Amp)
2,026 PED Iron Stone 2/4/2010 (OA 105)

Before Tracker
6,985 PED Ambulimax Young 03/06/2008 (X5 + dante)
6,854 PED Ambulimax Young 03/05/2008 (X5 + dante)
---------------------------------------
Total PED cycled in TT - 5,376,400 PED
---------------------------------------

2,533 PED Mermoth Guardian 05/24/2006 (Maddox IV + with the good ole dante amp)
2,648 PED Armax Bull Young 01/21/2006 (EP-40 Merc + Eamp 13)

And ALL of it - looted by depositing my own money into EU.
The Iron tower was luck as well as the Atrax Stalker , and bull was my 2nd ever HOF, all the rest were FORCED loots (meaning i forced the system to pay by burning , burning , burning HUGE amounts of TT from depositing)

 

[fluske]

agis,you can always do worse..look at my trackerresults

Favorite Mob: Sumima
Largest Loot: 2,619 PED
Total Loot: 413,425 PED
Current rank (30 days): 62 of 3369



Value

Mob

Time



2,619 PED

Sumima Old

4/22/2010



2,124 PED

Atrox Dominant

4/22/2011



1,946 PED

Sumima Young

11/2/2008



1,369 PED

Longu Guardian

9/1/2009



1,297 PED

Longu Prowler

9/1/2009



1,156 PED

Argonaut Hunter

10/26/2008



1,073 PED

Fungoid Young

5/19/2008



760 PED

Aurli Watcher

7/17/2008



678 PED

Atrox Stalker

9/9/2009



552 PED

Atrox Prowler

4/29/2011

 

[Jimmy B]

For one im like valentin , I have had really bad luck and I have deposited about 22,000USD (into hunting - I have hardly any gear, since jan 2008 , for the record ive cycled ~5.3 million ped in that time in TT, I always have used the best i have been able to get even if i had to pay MU for thie items.

I used XT from SIB at level 66 right through to now, also used Felis, Customised Kan G2 x 2, Geotrek Kisf, Isis BL1600, HL20, Uti, Saou, CB29.. in Jan 2008 i was using X5 all are L. Got my delta SGA up to tier 5 and now renting a unique powerful gun, Whatever the best L gun for my level, I use , I always use enhancers and always use EAMP 15 or Evil.

Maybe you have had bad luck, I don't know. But the gear you are using is certainly costing you money. Economy-wise EAmp-15 is terrible compared to A105/106. Enhancers aren't always an improvement in terms of economy either. Even if you're a believer in the fixed-return-rate-regardless-of-economy theory (seems to me people who are not tend to do better in general) you're still wiping out huge amounts of PED with those high markup L guns.

There are many lucky avatars that never deposit or havent deposited in a long time, pavo, das, gorro, BD, skippie, SLOE, Alin, minime, Charon, Laban etc..

Lucky...or smart?

37. Agis Agis Mckracken 4467 731,595 PEDs

My Highest Loots
23,633 PED Kreltin Young 5/29/2009 (Customised Kanerium G2 + Eamp 15)
18,999 PED Atrox Young 4/20/2011 (XT + evil)
16,834 PED Ambulimax Young 11/7/2010 (Frean D delta SGA + bull tac 50 T5)
12,480 PED Proteron Old 2/16/2010 (Geotrek Kisf + evil)
7,803 PED Vulcan Drake Old Alpha 3/23/2011 (XT + evil)

I think you'll find plenty of avatars on Tracker with a worse top 5 loots for that amount cycled tbh.

It's the markup you're spending that is hurting your PED card imo, not your luck.

 

[Agis]

Economy I dont believe in Ive always been a firm believer in TT burn , Why do Mindark release amps like Eamp 15 and such, and even in support message to them years ago , they said all weapons ingame are correctly balanced. And fluske , you have teamed alot in the past, I very rarely team up.

Its all about TT burned - Economy can Prolong your PED true (yes i go running around with a super eco Imp-21 and A203 sometimes when i have no money) , but because of less TT burn you get worse loot and with a supremely eco gun like the Imp 21 i have personally seen no improvement in loot , in fact its worse loot than the XT but a few lucky little hofs you get.

Jimmy you are implying that expensive guns are the way to go (Mod Merc, imk2, i2870) , Id rather go with guns that have more TT burn then ones that have less, And even Mindark said 'Decay All Counts' so i see no point hunting for 4 hours with Imp21 on one mob then hunting 90 mins with an XT . Your burning more PED in less time therefore your cycle is much higher than someone with an eco setup - burning the slow way . your 90% cycle return comes faster when you burn alot more PED. than with eco setup. MU on guns is dead money i know that but i never count MU in my stats never , and L weapons always have that extra loot UL weapons dont have.

Mindark are slowly distancing themselves from those 'old school' weapons as you have noticed, soon they will release more superior guns than those old school guns (going right up to level 140 i think).

Remember some people cant hunt 12-15 hours a day, only a couple of hours maybe 6 hours at the most.

 

[Agis]

I think you'll find plenty of avatars on Tracker with a worse top 5 loots for that amount cycled tbh.

.

Well you go through the top 50 all time ACTIVE hunters on tracker, and try to find someone that has had worse loot than me and hasn't had a loot (hunting/mining/crafting) over 25,000PED, There are very few (can only see like 3 other people and some there may have shared Team ATHs) and had big loots before tracker came.

 

[fluske]

Well you go through the top 50 all time ACTIVE hunters on tracker, and try to find someone that has had worse loot than me and hasn't had a loot (hunting/mining/crafting) over 25,000PED, There are very few (can only see like 3 other people and some there may have shared Team ATHs) and had big loots before tracker came.

ehh..im at place 45 alltime hunters and i still only have 2.5k as highest
and i teamed alot with my wife yea,but we had 253k in tracker and only 1 loot over 2.5k also,and that loot i didnt even got 1 pec of it,i already had mission compled on sums so my wife did all damage and got all loot

i challenge you to find 1 ava that has worse trackerstats then me in all top 100

 

[Agis]

ehh..im at place 45 alltime hunters and i still only have 2.5k as highest
and i teamed alot with my wife yea,but we had 253k in tracker and only 1 loot over 2.5k also,and that loot i didnt even got 1 pec of it,i already had mission compled on sums so my wife did all damage and got all loot

i challenge you to find 1 ava that has worse trackerstats then me in all top 100

Didnt you loot ULCB24 ?

and are you are depositor or non-depositer ?

Have you withdrawn (cause that does effect loot somehow for some people)

All globals are a multiplier of cost per kill (all decay + ammo)
even with costs of ULCB24+ beast you kill an aurli weak (1500hp mob) 59.25 average damage per shot,
26 shots to kill - 5.0PED cost to kill (therefore you need a multiplier of 10 to global)

my costs with XT+evil on aurli week (1500hp mob) 105 average damage per shot, 15 shots to kill - 5.14PED cost to kill ( I need a multiplier of 9 to global )

ok we mention the uneco swine deluxe+ evil
on aurli weak (1500hp mob) 119 average damage per shot . 13 shots to kill - 7.55 PED cost to kill (Will global on a 7 multiplier)


Misses always increase your cost therefore better loots and Critical Hits reduces the cost therefore less loot when a multiplier is hit.

 

[Infinity01]

I wouldn't call it a goal....

Well, maybe I would. 3k? LOL.. I'll be shocked if we ever break 253 PED (our highest loot ever, from back in 2008).

Right now, we've decided the best thing for us to to is hunt economically, and take care of some iron challenges. I'm about 2500 into the 5k Shinkiba one, almost done with 1k Argos, and we have several of the others (Corns, Feffs, Molisk, Merp) at the 1k level and moving up. We've invested (I really do consider it an investment) in unlimited SIB weapons for those too so we don't have to keep paying markup on (L) weapons.... I really hate buying limited anything. I even use my MF chip for healing instead of buying FAPs.

Now and then we take a break, hunt something big like Drone Coordinators as part of the Robot Invasion with purchased (L) weapons (LR53 for me), or maybe just some Troopers, or something with our Society just cause we've always liked blowing up drones, and we might as well use that Vigi we have now and then.

this is my obseervation:

HOFs and globals are bought by players.... (with rare exceptions)

but yes i know there are loot cycle too... I'm an one of those extremely bad loot cycle. .

In your case, playing since 2005, and have recently unlocked serendipity, means you are an extremely low ped cycler........as such the system is unlikely to reward you with HOF.

EDIT: BTW, I think a protracted bad loot cycle, and a lot of coffee can make someone paranoid (i'm for now)

 

[das]

There are many lucky avatars that never deposit or havent deposited in a long time, pavo, das, gorro, BD, skippie, SLOE, Alin, minime, Charon, Laban etc..

It's true, I haven't depo'd in 2 years..
This doesn't change that fact that in total, I depo'd about the same amount as you
We also seem to have very diffrent playstyles, where you force TT turnover, I pick the eco way.
1st with the ul hl15+106 & now with the i2870+106's (T3.9 but hardly use enhancers)

You have 732k loot on tracker & 4469 globals (163.79 ped/global avg) where I have 535k & 3634 globals (147.2 ped/global avg)
Ever considered that my avg loot sucks waaaay harder then yours & I still need to loose more b4 I get some payback from the system? Do you really think I'm jumping to get another oil ATH?
fyi, my last +1k loot after mu been 760 globals ago, & that was that 4.4k prison co..
What they prolly didn't tell you was that I still lost +3k after mu that week with untaxed 'eco' hunting.


41,525 PED Araneatrox Mature 4/27/2010
37,707 PED Chomper Mature 4/4/2009
36,555 PED Kreltin Young 2/27/2011
4,408 PED Prison C.O 5/5/2011
2,345 PED Aurli Weak 6/28/2010
2,205 PED Second Entity Generation 01 7/10/2009
2,157 PED Kreltin Young 8/28/2008
2,127 PED Faucervix Old 7/10/2008
2,099 PED Scipulor Mature 8/30/2009
1,189 PED Osseocollum Young 12/14/2008

feel free to see how much time & globals there are between my ubers, tracker stats are open
I can also tell you that I did scip quest for example 14.4k big ones & 2.2k small ones with 415 ped as biggest loot & trust me, that wasn't the only streak that sucked ASS.
Maybe it has a reason I haven't been very active the last few weeks

 

[Profit]

Deposits allow you to cycle more. That's all.
Deposits have NO positive impact on your loot. I have had 4 avatars over the years, 3 deposit, 1 not. The majority of my best loot experiences, happened on my non-deposit avatar. The largest loot in TT value was on my current avatar (she cycles 10x more PED than any other I've had because I deposit more).
Funnily enough, the non-deposit avatar was the only avatar I ever tried to be "eco" with, seriously.

 

[Agis]

It's true, I haven't depo'd in 2 years..
This doesn't change that fact that in total, I depo'd about the same amount as you
We also seem to have very diffrent playstyles, where you force TT turnover, I pick the eco way.
1st with the ul hl15+106 & now with the i2870+106's (T3.9 but hardly use enhancers)

You have 732k loot on tracker & 4469 globals (163.79 ped/global avg) where I have 535k & 3634 globals (147.2 ped/global avg)
Ever considered that my avg loot sucks waaaay harder then yours & I still need to loose more b4 I get some payback from the system? Do you really think I'm jumping to get another oil ATH?
fyi, my last +1k loot after mu been 760 globals ago, & that was that 4.4k prison co..
What they prolly didn't tell you was that I still lost +3k after mu that week with untaxed 'eco' hunting.


41,525 PED Araneatrox Mature 4/27/2010
37,707 PED Chomper Mature 4/4/2009
36,555 PED Kreltin Young 2/27/2011
4,408 PED Prison C.O 5/5/2011
2,345 PED Aurli Weak 6/28/2010
2,205 PED Second Entity Generation 01 7/10/2009
2,157 PED Kreltin Young 8/28/2008
2,127 PED Faucervix Old 7/10/2008
2,099 PED Scipulor Mature 8/30/2009
1,189 PED Osseocollum Young 12/14/2008

feel free to see how much time & globals there are between my ubers, tracker stats are open
I can also tell you that I did scip quest for example 14.4k big ones & 2.2k small ones with 415 ped as biggest loot & trust me, that wasn't the only streak that sucked ASS.
Maybe it has a reason I haven't been very active the last few weeks

This is the point though you have had some good ATHs and yes there are bad times, the point is i havent had not 1 yet and no UL guns in loot especially, Ive never withdrawn yet, all burnt in hunting (some mining) I am trying to realise how much TT it takes to burn to get on those lucky streaks , ive only found it once ever and it only lasted a day or 2, those massive loots each year make a difference , if i ever had those type of loots yeah id take a step back , but for me it hasn't happened yet, im trying to convince my partner that this game is not gambling there is a system and i will get some of my 20,000 usd back (even if its just a 1/3), and most likely i havent been lucky enough to hit that dream loot yet.

Therefore i need to cycle more and more PED until i hit that streak that Laban has hit recently

 

[das]

some simple math..
163.79-147.2= 16.59
you're avg global size - mine
16.59 ped*3643 globals = 60437 ped diffrence that I got less in TT
pretty much covers the 40k mu from the hl15 & the 22.5k from a R150

 

[Jimmy B]

Jimmy you are implying that expensive guns are the way to go (Mod Merc, imk2, i2870) , Id rather go with guns that have more TT burn then ones that have less, And even Mindark said 'Decay All Counts' so i see no point hunting for 4 hours with Imp21 on one mob then hunting 90 mins with an XT . Your burning more PED in less time therefore your cycle is much higher than someone with an eco setup - burning the slow way . your 90% cycle return comes faster when you burn alot more PED. than with eco setup. MU on guns is dead money i know that but i never count MU in my stats never , and L weapons always have that extra loot UL weapons dont have.

If I was going to deposit the sort of money you have, Mod Merc/Imk2 would be the way I'd go yes. I don't have the time to spare to justify those sort of investments though.

But you misunderstand what I mean by economy. For a given mob, the less you spend killing it, the more economical you are being. Often the best economy is achieved with a high burn rate (the faster you kill it, the less armour decay and fap decay you take). But like you say, all the MU you burn is dead money and that kills your economy. If you added up all the MU you've spent on guns I wonder how much of your total losses would be accounted for.

I can't claim with any certainty to know whether your loot theories are accurate or not. But I'd assume my playing style is wrong before I'd assume I've been unlucky.

Well you go through the top 50 all time ACTIVE hunters on tracker, and try to find someone that has had worse loot than me and hasn't had a loot (hunting/mining/crafting) over 25,000PED, There are very few (can only see like 3 other people and some there may have shared Team ATHs) and had big loots before tracker came.

You've burnt about 6 times more PED on hunting than I have since tracker, and have 5 loots higher than my biggest. That doesn't seem massively disproportionate to me.

 

[Laradon]

Big loots have nothing to do with cycle or depo etc.
Only rewarding good loots to depoing players is a denial of service, thus forbidden.
Cycle rewards you with globals hofs etc that fill you up to your 90% return.
Big loots are cash-bulks that were gathered through global losses, auction fees etc etc and then provided to the _lucky_ one. Only thing you can say, if someone cycles around enough and plays 24/7 ofc his chance is significantly higher to get one of those big cash gatherings, just because he increases his chance with constant actvity.

 

[Sleeper]

as always, the answer is a) it depends and b) a little bit of everything