FYI: New vehicles,old scam

[TheMZ]

I agree that its nice if someone points these kinds of things out...

I agree with everything you say there.

Does anyone care to elaborate why did this guy get banned? On what account did he get this? Cause he has only six posts? Cause his REP bar is red? Cause 90% people here bashed him for saying the actual truth? Is this really somebody's second account?...

 

[AlphaGeek]

You'd have to ask the moderators to be sure, but here's some guesswork.

The troll's initial post in this thread was edited by a moderator. Presumably there was some content that was not allowed.

Every post (all 6 of them) by the troll was inflammitory and argumentative.

The content of the posts also looked to indicate that the troll had more knowlege of the game than the average 6 post forum noob. The forum does log IP addresses, so a moderator could sift through that data and see if it was a second account.

 

[TigerSkin]

when enhancers first appeared everyone was waiting to log in first to do smth to grab new bps ... that was an opening of a new crafting field - promising one ... so all were nervous about it

so I logged in and what I see on auc - several enhancer bp-s for about +40 or +80 ped each

lol I thought ... paing so much ... and for this one ...

I know the value of prompt investment ... so was thinking to buy one ...
BUT I hesitated to buy ... something in me did not want to let me buy the bp ... and I was in this stage for about 10-15 minutes ... damn period of thinking ...

and suddenly an idea came to me to just visit the technician ...

and voala ... same bp-s were for 1 pec each ...

same case here ... but I think many would "buy" that

 

[Oleg]

It baffles me that some people say this isn't a scam, and always do whenever this issue is brought up.

It's an attempt to deceive people into handing over cash for something that's worth a tiny amount above nothing at all. Which is, more or less, the definition of a scam.

It's stupid to say that people should just be better informed and do more research. The whole point of scamming is that it preys on the ignorance or naivety of the victim. Trying to scam people who know enough to see through the fakery is obviously not going to work.

 

[Az Bloodz]

It baffles me that some people say this isn't a scam, and always do whenever this issue is brought up.

It's an attempt to deceive people into handing over cash for something that's worth a tiny amount above nothing at all. Which is, more or less, the definition of a scam.

Well it still is no scam. Maybe a rip off price but that's all. People are offering something and if anyone is accepting this offer it's a deal. They aren't lying nor deceiving you*. I sold many stuff to people knowing someone else selling cheaper. Am I a scammer now?

*of course this ain't honorable behaviour

 

[Rayne Jade]

Post was edited because the title contained language other than English. What he posted was not edited.

It was a duplicate account. We eventually find out...

BPs with a QR greater than .01 are not in original condition. Same with tiered Opalo's. I did not mean to include those since they are not available from the TT or technician in that modified form.
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[SpikeBlack]

I've seen many things available on the auction that are or were available to buy from tech's or weapon traders.

And also in shop keepers infront of banks

I wouldn't ban them completely as the QR rating on blueprints do make a big price difference just colour the text or the background of all the tt items in the list to make it obvious that they're tt items.

 

[Oleg]

Well it still is no scam. Maybe a rip off price but that's all. People are offering something and if anyone is accepting this offer it's a deal. They aren't lying nor deceiving you*. I sold many stuff to people knowing someone else selling cheaper. Am I a scammer now?

*of course this ain't honorable behaviour

Selling items with fluctuating market rates is a completely different scenario.

Technician BPs without QR don't have a fluctuating market rate, their value is 1 PEC, no more and no less. Selling at anything higher is deception. Trying to sell them is an attempt at deception.

Do you also think that selling a bottle of tap water for $5 is not a scam?

 

[Az Bloodz]

Considering I am putting this bottle in a storage with that price tag and someone feels like buying it personally I do not think this is a scam. As long as I don't lie about usability, rarity and such things.

 

[Oleg]

Considering I am putting this bottle in a storage with that price tag and someone feels like buying it personally I do not think this is a scam. As long as I don't lie about usability, rarity and such things.

The price tag itself is an implicit lie about usability, rarity and such things

 

[Az Bloodz]

The price tag itself is an implicit lie about usability, rarity and such things

No it ain't at least not here. In Germany any price tag is just an offer you do not have to accept. You could even try to negotiate. In other countries people are proposing a way too high price for something but they are expecting negotiations. Of course this is not the case here and I just wanted to point out that a suggested price not always implies usability or rarity. People should stop assuming this, one of the problems in capitalism.

There is/was a great example explain my point of view:

In Germany someone sold air from Berlin in a bottle for like 10 bucks. This ain't rare nor useful and you can get it almost for free or have someone sending it to you. Still this is no scam unless it ain't air from Berlin.

 

[xaph]

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No it ain't at least not here. In Germany any price tag is just an offer you do not have to accept. You could even try to negotiate. In other countries people are proposing a way too high price for something but they are expecting negotiations. Of course this is not the case here and I just wanted to point out that a suggested price not always implies usability or rarity. People should stop assuming this, one of the problems in capitalism.

There is/was a great example explain my point of view:

In Germany someone sold air from Berlin in a bottle for like 10 bucks. This ain't rare nor useful and you can get it almost for free or have someone sending it to you. Still this is no scam unless it ain't air from Berlin.

Therin is the issue, you buy air but you are aware its a token

You buy a blueprint in auction and find its 4 sale via the Technician for say for 1000 % +

How is buying air similar, and EU item when it has a base value set in game and some items readily available via a technician and now MU in the auction system.

Conscience would dictate your approach to this matter of sale but knowlege would be more powerful I would think.

Incredulous markups...no!

Where is conscience?....lost to scamming, obvious to the informed !

 

[Oleg]

No it ain't at least not here. In Germany any price tag is just an offer you do not have to accept. You could even try to negotiate. In other countries people are proposing a way too high price for something but they are expecting negotiations. Of course this is not the case here and I just wanted to point out that a suggested price not always implies usability or rarity. People should stop assuming this, one of the problems in capitalism.

There is/was a great example explain my point of view:

In Germany someone sold air from Berlin in a bottle for like 10 bucks. This ain't rare nor useful and you can get it almost for free or have someone sending it to you. Still this is no scam unless it ain't air from Berlin.

But we're not talking about German law, we're talking about the EU auctioneer, and as far as I'm aware he isn't open to negotiation

Though on the same subject, I think I'm right saying that in UK law, charging for tap water is illegal.

 

[Az Bloodz]

I did not want to discuss any laws here and as I said it is not comparable to this situation. The point of this example was that the price does not necessarily implies anything. If you think something is rare/useful/good/desirable or whatever just because it is expensive then you are totally wrong and you are the only one to blame.

We can agree on:

1. This is no good behaviour
2. The seller(s) are taking advantage of new player's unawareness/lack of knowledge
3. No one should buy these BPs at this price

And even though it is a rip-off price I do not think it is scam. He is offering a BP for a certain price and if anyone agrees on buying the deal is done. This is different from Trust scam/armor scam/coloring scam/upgrade scam where you do not receive what you have agreed on.

 

[Trina Xenophage]

Only thing missing from here now is the asshats who always say...

"What if its just someone using it to get ped from a friend that is not on at same time"

Add to the newby stickey thread to look at technician after a new VU to make sure they know what bp's are tt junk so this does not happen and be done with this.

 

[Oleg]

I did not want to discuss any laws here and as I said it is not comparable to this situation. The point of this example was that the price does not necessarily implies anything. If you think something is rare/useful/good/desirable or whatever just because it is expensive then you are totally wrong and you are the only one to blame.

We can agree on:

1. This is no good behaviour
2. The seller(s) are taking advantage of new player's unawareness/lack of knowledge
3. No one should buy these BPs at this price

And even though it is a rip-off price I do not think it is scam. He is offering a BP for a certain price and if anyone agrees on buying the deal is done. This is different from Trust scam/armor scam/coloring scam/upgrade scam where you do not receive what you have agreed on.

Yes I think we agree on all of that, I guess it's just a difference in definition. To me a rip-off is a scam, I don't see any distinction between the two.

 

[Redfrog]

I also notice that the soc the alt account claims to be a member of doesn't exist.
Also searched for 'Gremlin' and 'Alliance'

 

[True Juan]

Yes I think we agree on all of that, I guess it's just a difference in definition. To me a rip-off is a scam, I don't see any distinction between the two.

RIP-OFF:
- Buying a bp on auction for +40 when it can be bought from a technician for 0.01
- "Buying sweat 3 ped / 1000 bottles

SCAM:
- I'll upgrade your armor from goblin to nemesis for 50 peds
- Setting up a team(leader takes all) where you tell everyone that you will devide all the loot after the hunt and when you should, you just log off

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So basically what you are saying in your posts is, that if I SOLD anything for more than its worth, I'm scamming someone? If I put ALL my BPs in auction and sell them for +50 I'm a scammer? Come on Thats just pure nonsense.

I'll go to ebay, and I see 2 exact items, one costing 10$ and one 50$ -> If I buy the one for 50$, the guy scammed me? NO, I was just plain stupid, thats all.

TJ

 

[jjmatrix]

I agree that its nice if someone points these kinds of things out, but I also agree with the guy that got banned.

It's an RCE, ppl will always try to find a way to get a few pec. If someone is stupid enough to fall for it, then they deserve it.

I had to do a LOT of reading and research before I understood most of the things in this universe. If someone doesnt want to lose a leg, they should do the same. Its clearly NOT A SCAM !!! Are you guys really trying to tell me, that its SELLERS fault??? That someone that doesn't care to read and research, is being scammed? lol

And why did the guy get a ban? If it really is a second account, ok, but if not... whats the reason?

TJ

NOTE: And just so you guys know, I have no idea who this guy is, so I'm not trying to defend someone here -> just trying to be reasonable

He didn't get banned because he said that people falling for that action are stupid and the seller is smart; he got banned because he trashed this thread (and everyone in it) in which someone pointed out that those BP at QR 0.1 are available from the technician.

Is it a scam? Debatable... Should people be made aware of it? Absolutely.

 

[Rayne Jade]

Also wrong. Banned because that account a duplicate made by someone that was already banned with his original account. Despite what many think, we don't mind debate. Just keep it civil
Posted via Mobile Device

 

[True Juan]

He didn't get banned because he said that people falling for that action are stupid and the seller is smart; he got banned because he trashed this thread (and everyone in it) in which someone pointed out that those BP at QR 0.1 are available from the technician.

Is it a scam? Debatable... Should people be made aware of it? Absolutely.

Actually he got banned cause it was a second account


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EDIT: lol, Rayne beat me to it

 

[Oleg]

So basically what you are saying in your posts is, that if I SOLD anything for more than its worth, I'm scamming someone? If I put ALL my BPs in auction and sell them for +50 I'm a scammer? Come on Thats just pure nonsense.

No, of course that's not what I'm saying at all. I made a clear distinction in a previous post. A very good deal, or a very bad deal, doesn't have to be a rip-off. In extreme cases it might be.

I can't see much point in arguing about a word.

 

[Az Bloodz]

I can't see much point in arguing about a word.

Well I can see a point in thsi case though. Even though both are unhonorable a scam is against the EULA and illegal wheras a rip-off is ok in terms of Entropian law.

 

[Oleg]

Well I can see a point in thsi case though. Even though both are unhonorable a scam is against the EULA and illegal wheras a rip-off is ok in terms of Entropian law.

There is no such thing as Entropian law, and the vast majority of scammers go unpunished.

 

[jjmatrix]

Also wrong. Banned because that account a duplicate made by someone that was already banned with his original account. Despite what many think, we don't mind debate. Just keep it civil
Posted via Mobile Device

Right ; I wasn't talking about the "official"reason.

 

[Dab]

Actually he got banned cause it was a second account


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EDIT: lol, Rayne beat me to it

It was that shadowraider guy again. So you can get his real avatar name for future reference.

 

[Igorl]

Well - i must admit I bought one combustor BP from auc for 3 PED b/o before I realised its the TT one

Anyways -> if someone is so happy earning that quater from my pocket - I say:

- if I can buy someones' happyness with a quater - its well worth the investment.

Regards

I.