Rules

[Naifas Anaconda]

Dont even know who is teamcaptain for Denmark, but I was asked to give my words on his here...

Same thing in my team.. I don't know who the captain is or if there's any.
About your opinion, I respect it of course. The % rule was made in order to substract a portion of points proportional to the players in infraction. I understand that, especially if the players that are late are online (now, yes, that is inadmissible). But imagine if a certain player of a certain team crashes in the beginning (or after a few minutes), right after entering his name in the team and doesn't contribute with any points because he is unable to play. The % rule will suck an important amount of accumulated points, points made by his team mates. It's like if in football you had a player injured and couldn't do any substitution during the whole match.. well, it's even worse... It's like having an injured player and because of that suffer a penalty because it's against the rules.

Just my opinion.

 

[Solaris]

It's like having an injured player and because of that suffer a penalty because it's against the rules.

Good point, but dont you agree that there should be a start/finish rule at all? Some sort of penalty?

 

[Hurrikane]

Good point, but dont you agree that there should be a start/finish rule at all? Some sort of penalty?

He does agree now, we're just trying to establish whether the penalty is too harsh.

Hurrikane

 

[Pheonyx]

An important question needs to be asked{because im too lazy to check scores }...

Would a change to portugals score here make any difference to their standing currently?

 

[Naifas Anaconda]

An important question needs to be asked{because im too lazy to check scores }...

Would a change to portugals score here make any difference to their standing currently?

Nope. We still loose, but imagine if this happens again to one of u guys. I'm not only looking at my own belly here. It's just about fairness i think.
I'm not against a penalty, like hurrikane said.

PS: and i'm too sleepy right now to say anything else...

 

[Frigid]

The rule is part and parcel of the competition. Why 3 hours? Why not 2? 4? Why 4 hunters? Why not 5 or 6? We could debate the wisdom of every aspect and in the end, it doesn't have to make sense...it's just the way it's played.

Why is a touch down in american football 6 points? Instead of debating the point, players and coaches accept it as a factor when planning their strategies. Much in the same way, the start/finish is part of the strategy. Now, disconnects are unfortunate....I have backup plans in case my primary ISP goes out, from a local coffeeshop with a wifi to running to Fry's(a big electronics store) and grab a wireless card.

The start finish is a good thing for comraderie. Start together, finish together. It puts limits on where one can hunt. The verification of disconnects is yet another reason I would push for "embedded" judges to watch for these.

"Dude! I can't make it back from CND in time!"

"Bro! Just log-off, we'll say you DC'd....rock on!"

As the tournament goes on, I would also push for embedded judges to avoid the "ghost hunters": You add extra people to the team, then kick them from the team before you take a screenie, then re-add them after the screenie is taken. Evil...illeegal...but hard to track...

we need judges *in* the teams.

Actually, if the judges pulled the nameplates for all of the team members, they could see disconnects from the icons. But still, we need protection from ghost hunters...

 

[Clam Jamphrie]

What he said

 

[Hurrikane]

The rule is part and parcel of the competition. Why 3 hours? Why not 2? 4? Why 4 hunters? Why not 5 or 6? We could debate the wisdom of every aspect and in the end, it doesn't have to make sense...it's just the way it's played.

Why is a touch down in american football 6 points? Instead of debating the point, players and coaches accept it as a factor when planning their strategies. Much in the same way, the start/finish is part of the strategy. Now, disconnects are unfortunate....I have backup plans in case my primary ISP goes out, from a local coffeeshop with a wifi to running to Fry's(a big electronics store) and grab a wireless card.

The start finish is a good thing for comraderie. Start together, finish together. It puts limits on where one can hunt. The verification of disconnects is yet another reason I would push for "embedded" judges to watch for these.

"Dude! I can't make it back from CND in time!"

"Bro! Just log-off, we'll say you DC'd....rock on!"

As the tournament goes on, I would also push for embedded judges to avoid the "ghost hunters": You add extra people to the team, then kick them from the team before you take a screenie, then re-add them after the screenie is taken. Evil...illeegal...but hard to track...

we need judges *in* the teams.

Actually, if the judges pulled the nameplates for all of the team members, they could see disconnects from the icons. But still, we need protection from ghost hunters...

Really you could argue this further, and suggest you could influence the Judges, or even myself, to post globals not scored and screenshots not valid; there are many ways cheating could occur in this, or any competition. The thing is, I don't think anyone is cheating. The teams you'd expect to get high scores have done, but not ridiculously high. Good teams have scored low, average teams have shone; but nothing I've seen in-game or that has come to me has left me thinking anyone was cheating. Added to this is community policing (thanks for that phrase Jamira); in this most public of events, with arm-chair critics at every tp and teams meeting each other at the spawns, the chance of most types of cheating being caught at some point are high; and you'd only need to be caught once to be amongst the most unpopular avatars in the game, as well as the most unlikely to take part in a WoF again.

Also, as MA are now helping us all enjoy this a little more; they might start watching for cheats themselves, something they are very able to do.....

As the tournament goes on, I would also push for embedded judges to avoid the "ghost hunters": You add extra people to the team, then kick them from the team before you take a screenie, then re-add them after the screenie is taken. Evil...illeegal...but hard to track...

.... and also a lot of work... you'd have to clear all the "was kicked from team" messages, edit the loot distribution, rejoin them for the next mobs and do it all over again should any members global elsewhere... probably easier to play by the rules and hunt like merry hell

Also, as most teams are finding it hard getting 4 legitimate players online at the same time for their hunts, I just can't see it happening.

Hurrikane


...anyway, back to the question; is Portugal's current result fair or should the MIA rule be changed to -3 points?

 

[Shadowsong]

I have no objection to a revision of the penalty for late returns - 3 point deduction per missing team member seems fair, especially considering how this rule can impact on smaller teams.

Edit: My captain Major Putty is the official voice of the SA team - see post below. Consider this a change of mind on my behalf

 

[majorputty]

I personally feel that rules should not be bent in any way, this is one of the biggest events in game.

If we start bending rules now, later in the tournament player will say... “but you did it for ...”

Rule changes should wait till next year.

MP

 

[Ardorj]

I'm for the -3 point penalty.

- Ardorj of the Dutch

 

[safara]

I think the rules should be changed as little as possible during the event, preferably not at all.

 

[Fairy]

not a vote, but my thoughts..

I say that IF there are ways to make difference between:

A, not back in time AND not online because I crashed
B, not back in time due to other issues caused by ingame related stuff,
gone to the wrong place and cant get back, lagg, cnd, out of ME etc

I would like to vote yes, change it to -3 poins for A,
and no keep the full penalty for B

But im not convinced that it is possible to separate those two alternatives even if the judge has all of the hunters in FL, someone might just go way off and logout/crash when there´s not time to get home....
not saying that anyone would, but there´s the possibilty....



how long does it take to restart the computor and log in after a huge crash? more than 10 min? 15?
maybe just extend the timeframe with 5min more??

And yes im sry for portugal who had problems and lost points because of the rule...


What if a team decides to take a penalty for one player not back in time, due to sending him/her to a remote part of the world for the better chance of getting a global.
If they score a global of more than the -3 points penalty its still worth it.If they dont get a global they have lost 3 points.
If the team has high points and many globals they might think that 3 poins is not much to loose. Just a few % out of youre total.
But if you are in a lowpoints team those 3 points can be like 25% of youre total.

Now change the -3 points back to the -25% if one out of four aint back, thats a different story.
The Teams might wanna gamble over that, or not, but it will make it more on the same terms...


Well if ill have to choose....
As major said... changes chould wait til next tournament.

 

[Caveman]

I totally agree on the NO side!

Think of it as these two scenarios:
1. Team that have 50 points -3 points (not much penalty)

2. Team that have 4 points -3 points (Huge penalty, much more unfair then the original settings as we all agreed on by joining WoF)

 

[Caveman]

Its a good thing to make it more clear about the time rule. That it is 3 hours hunting and after that 10 minutes to get back.
Last weekend we (Amethera) hunted, we had to be back within the 3 hour limit. Dont really think it would have changed anything for us less then more decay and ammoburn tho .

But a rule is a rule and should be clear so even the judges cant be wrong.

 

[Frigid]

I personally feel that rules should not be bent in any way, this is one of the biggest events in game.

If we start bending rules now, later in the tournament player will say... “but you did it for ...”

Rule changes should wait till next year.

MP

Very good point. By joining the tournament everyone participating did, in essence, agree to the rules as they were. Strategies going into the tournament are made by these rules.

Make changes and refine them for NEXT year...

 

[Frigid]

how long does it take to restart the computor and log in after a huge crash? more than 10 min? 15?
maybe just extend the timeframe with 5min more??
.

Not just a computer crash. I have had my ISP go out at wierd times....for long periods of time. It not very ofetn, but I get annoyed when I have to stare at that blinking light on my cable modem while I know I am suppsoed to be online for a hunt, raid or meeting.

 

[Caveman]

Not just a computer crash. I have had my ISP go out at wierd times....for long periods of time. It not very ofetn, but I get annoyed when I have to stare at that blinking light on my cable modem while I know I am suppsoed to be online for a hunt, raid or meeting.

Hmm, well the ISP failure is out of hand for everyone so i still say stick to the current rules!

 

[Frigid]

Hmm, well the ISP failure is out of hand for everyone so i still say stick to the current rules!

Truly, but I have identified local coffee shops with wifi and have considered having a backup dial-up service or even a wireless internet card as an emergency backup for when *I* am hunting....

Where there is a will there is a way. Dedication requires invoking Prometheus more often than not....

 

[Frigid]

Really you could argue this further,

CRAP! I had typed a huge response and hit soemthing on my keyboard and now it's all gone. I don't have the effort to re-type it all...grrr...

Anyway, I hope everyone is above board. Competition of any kind can bring about the worst in people. I guess we'll only really come down on cheating when we cross that bridge, though I see no penalties listed for teams caught cheating.

OTOH, less rules might just be part of the competition and it might be fun to have people running around like a cartoon thinking of ways to trip-up other teams or get ahead themselves

Changes to the rules can be applied retro-actively NEXT year to deal with any cheating that happens this year...that we catch.

Ta!

 

[Hurrikane]

though I see no penalties listed for teams caught cheating.

Any Team caught cheating will no longer be a Team. And that country will never enter a WoF again, as long as I'm in charge. How's that?

Hurrikane

 

[Frigid]

Any Team caught cheating will no longer be a Team. And that country will never enter a WoF again, as long as I'm in charge. How's that?

Hurrikane

That's what I like to hear!

Paste this to the rules and I'll

Hmmm...country or team members? I'd hate to punish an entire country for the errors of a bad 4-8 people...

 

[Hurrikane]

That's what I like to hear!

Paste this to the rules and I'll

Hmmm...country or team members? I'd hate to punish an entire country for the errors of a bad 4-8 people...

Country. Let them live with the hate of their neighbours.

Initial post updated.

Hurrikane

 

[Frigid]

Country. Let them live with the hate of their neighbours.

Initial post updated.

Hurrikane

HARSH!!!!

...and yet...me like!

Oh yeah...

Thanks! I'll sleep and play better now...

 

[Naifas Anaconda]

Let them rot in hell ... for how long, by the way?

 

[Naifas Anaconda]

I say that IF there are ways to make difference between:

A, not back in time AND not online because I crashed
B, not back in time due to other issues caused by ingame related stuff,
gone to the wrong place and cant get back, lagg, cnd, out of ME etc

I would like to vote yes, change it to -3 poins for A,
and no keep the full penalty for B

Yeah, I agree, that's very hard to actually find out which of those happens, but I would say the B situation is more likely to happen near the end of the time of the event. When a logoff happens around the middle of the event, then A is more probable.

 

[Shadowsong]

Any Team caught cheating will no longer be a Team. And that country will never enter a WoF again, as long as I'm in charge. How's that?

Hurrikane

Country. Let them live with the hate of their neighbours.

Initial post updated.

Hurrikane

Damn, now why can't the EULA have stuff like this in? Long may you remain in charge, and a pox on cheaters.

That said, I have neither seen, nor even heard rumour of, any attempts to cheat. Judging by the spirit in which the event is being conducted so far, I believe we will not encounter this problem. None of the people I have had the pleasure of competing against seem like the kind to take a giant dump on their or their nation's reputation.

 

[Mikass]

Yeah, I agree, that's very hard to actually find out which of those happens, but I would say the B situation is more likely to happen near the end of the time of the event. When a logoff happens around the middle of the event, then A is more probable.

Wouldn`t be more simple to just take into consideration globals that took place in the specified hunting interval and cancel this "all back at starting point rule"?

 

[Hurrikane]

Wouldn`t be more simple to just take into consideration globals that took place in the specified hunting interval and cancel this "all back at starting point rule"?

No.


Hurrikane.

 

[Sid-Jahan]

Hi There,

A little something from captain of Poland.

IMO like somebody said before.... rules are rules and it's very bad idea to change them during event. To be true personally this rule don't make much sense to me... and should be change in next edition of this event, but not now.
The rules are for everybody, and any one of as can have the same technical problems.... what to say.... bad luck... there is no point to cry about it, we just have to keep going.
If we change this now, I'm sure that there will be more ppl soon that will try to change something else.

So, even if it is not the best rule, we should stick to it until next year.

Regards
Sid