Info: What really ONE system ?

[Mikeemooo]

Be serious please.

Not until you present a SINGLE shred of evidence that event suggests even the slightest bit of validity in these claims.

Until you can present that, this entire thread is all just the product of a very over active imagination.

Loot is JUST LIKE an elephant with 6 legs which repair themselves over time. Check out these numbers to prove it!

0111100101101111011101010010000001100001011100100110010100100000011000010010000001100100011010010110001101101011

 

[R4tt3xx]

Just go and play the game



Its the individual that pushes the button overides any theory.
Therfore



So re the op

Just enjoy the game mate. Throw your theories out the window. and have some fun

Input ----> process ----> output -----> process ----> output.

This IS my kind of fun, an intellectual challenge. No but on a more serious note, it's not as complex as some would think it is. It certainly is not random. There are so many sides to it. The most important one being economic and of course the most important to a player, returns.

I am a noob player so I can only invest in rookie equipment, im on layer 1, my expenses are between x and y. If I invest more money, I am still only at this layer due to my skills and equipment, but I am granted extra time as the time taken to cycle my peds will obviously be longer. I will also get the SAME tt returns as someone on a lower level.

The second level is larger than the 1st, I have to invest more in my skills and equipment, the pricing for my consumables (bombs / ammo / etc) increases but here is the kicker. On average MY RETURNS ARE THE SAME AS A NOOB... Oh and I should get more hofs, my time to cycle peds will be shorter.

And so on..... The more peds you put in, the larger you have to think. I don't need to think as much as others, my ped investment is very small, so I am on a very low / small layer.

 

[R4tt3xx]

Not until you present a SINGLE shred of evidence that event suggests even the slightest bit of validity in these claims.

Until you can present that, this entire thread is all just the product of a very over active imagination.

Loot is JUST LIKE an elephant with 6 legs which repair themselves over time. Check out these numbers to prove it!

0111100101101111011101010010000001100001011100100110010100100000011000010010000001100100011010010110001101101011

theres a gap in your binary. As for proof, think about it from all sides, both ingame and out of game. This makes more sense from an economic standpoint as real ingame mechanics.

Think about mmos in general and their level up mechanic, it is not a linear curve that most follow, its more like a log curve. Mindark wants to hook you into the game, so it starts cheap, VERY cheap, as you play and acquire skills you are forced to level, that levelling up, pushes you onto the next layer of the system, which just like the time it will take you to level again, IS LARGER. It is literally and mechanically a downward spiral, everything is running off of the same idea, take a business concept and make it virtual flesh.

Mindark is here to turn a profit and make money, but thats what they would want from their players, as well as hooking them into the system and making them fall deeper into it. At any time you can bail out, but after 300 days of inactivity, your character is wiped. All your investment and progress lost.

Mindark also stated that you have to balance your skills and equipment, if I do not have the financial resources to do that, then I cant balance my skills and equipment obviously. I can "chipout" my skills in order to restore that balance and get average returns. Its a tight balance between equipment, skills and time.

There are too many players here interested in deliverables in stead of what they should be looking for which is how does the process work, the process of loot, process of time, process of equipment, etc. Stop thinking short term...

 

[Mikeemooo]

theres a gap in your binary.

There's a gap in your hex.

 

[Mikeemooo]

As for proof, think about it from all sides, both ingame and out of game. This makes more sense from an economic standpoint as real ingame mechanics.

That is not proof, that is stab in the dark guessing. In fact, also quite comparable to faith.

 

[R4tt3xx]

But wait.... There is more.... Has anyone tried to tie stats to loot ? Tie level to loot ? Has anyone actually tried to role play their character, figure out what all those stats mean, they HAVE TO MEAN SOMETHING...

Has anyone tried to become their avatar. NO. Model it on real life. You trade skills and time for money, and money for equipment and skills and time. All of these things need to be in balance. If one is out, something has to compensate for it.

Your character has 300 days, what are you going to do with them ?

 

[R4tt3xx]

That is not proof, that is stab in the dark guessing. In fact, also quite comparable to faith.

Guessing ????? What is your current profession levels ?

 

[Mikeemooo]

Guessing ????? What is your current profession levels ?

What exactly does that have to do with anything? I've played since 2005.

Yes, it's guessing. Give me ANY statistical data to support any of your claims and I may think otherwise, until then, it's pure guess work.

 

[R4tt3xx]

What exactly does that have to do with anything? I've played since 2005.

Yes, it's guessing. Give me ANY statistical data to support any of your claims and I may think otherwise, until then, it's pure guess work.

I admit at this time, I do not have stat data. I am more of a designer / creator than an analyser of data.

This is a thread for theories, and this is a theory is it knot?

 

[Fishface]

I admit at this time, I do not have stat data. I am more of a designer / creator than an analyser of data.

This is a thread for theories, and this is a theory is it knot?

well technically, it's a hypothesis

 

[Mikeemooo]

Theory:
a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world; an organized system of accepted knowledge that applies in a variety of ...

Hypothesis:
a proposal intended to explain certain facts or observations

Guess:
To predict (a result or an event) without sufficient information. b. To assume, presume, or assert (a fact) without sufficient information

Which do you think best describes your thread?

 

[R4tt3xx]

Fair enough I am Too much thinking hurts the brain.

 

[Fishface]

ok then.

Conjecture: the formation or expression of an opinion or theory without sufficient evidence for proof.

 

[Yirrk]

The OP is forgetting one very important time-proven fact: Those wankers at MA are utterly incapable of devising a system as complicated as you suggest.

My guess is they use some lame ass gambling software they ripped off a slot machine somewhere and muddy/modify the output by constant daily manual manipulations as they see fit -- Voila, a "dynamic" loot system that nobody can figure out.

 

[Zacariaz]

I guess is that, to a certain degree at least, it's really simple probability, though people tend to forget/not know what this means.

It's really simple actually, but best proven with an example.

If you flip a coin, what is the probability that it will land tails up?

answer: 50%

If you then flip the coin again, what is the probability that it will land tails up?

answer: 50%

It doesn't matter if you fail or succeed, the answer will still be 50%.

However, if we ask another question:

If you flip a coin twice, what is then the probability that it will land tails up at least once?

answer: 75%.

This is fairly easy to understand, not least due to the examples, but the point I really want to make here is that you can never get the answer to be 100%.

If you flip a coin a million times, what is then the probability that it will land tails up at least once?

answer: ?

Unfortunately I didn't have a calculator at hand that was up to the challenge, but believe me when I say that the result is very close to 100%, though not quite there.

This is however using a simple coin. Translated to EU language that would mean that every time you go kill a mob, there's a 50% chance you'll HOF. So, if you change the parameters accordingly, take for example a 10.00 sided die, you'll see a very depressing results.


Just my two PEC.


Best regards.

 

[RobBuona]

Couldn't MindArk just make it completely random under the condition that each loot/claim/craft has a certain probability?

Let's use hunting. Think of it like the lottery: the rarest items have one ticket, while the very common stackables have 1,000 tickets or so. "No loot" would also have several tickets, obviously. It would have to be a bit more complex than since a "no loot" ticket would mean nothing else can be drawn, and it have to somehow control how many different types of stackables/items to draw - but to me, a system like this makes more sense from MindArk's standpoint. Why would they want a system that can be cracked?

EDIT: I see Zacariaz also touched on probability above. I just don't see why MA would want a system that isn't completely random, aside from the fact that they don't want a bunch of uber items dropping at once. But that's where the different numbers of "tickets" for each item/stackable comes in that I mentioned.

 

[Mikeemooo]

Well, as much as I don't believe a single loot theory that's been suggested (because there's no evidence), there does seem to be a regular enough pattern that's used for many things.

no no no no no no no no yes no yes no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no yes no no yes no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no yes no yes no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no yes yes no no no no no no no no no no no no yes no no yes no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no no yes no no no yes

That kinda thing

You see it with misses, crits, globals, weapon enhancers and a few other things.

So I don't really believe that loot is completely random, but I wouldn't have a clue to why it's not.

Some would argue that it's the peaks of a sine wave or similar, but I'm not convinced.

 

[Zacariaz]

EDIT: I see Zacariaz also touched on probability above. I just don't see why MA would want a system that isn't completely random, aside from the fact that they don't want a bunch of uber items dropping at once. But that's where the different numbers of "tickets" for each item/stackable comes in that I mentioned.

Why wouldn't MA want a completely random system? I'm afraid that's quite obvious. Everyone want to be a winner. If things are random, there are also winner and loser or lucky and unlucky people. The winners/lucky people will earn money and the losers/unlucky people will lose money and stop playing, thus MA will lose money as the loser/unlucky won't want to provide an income and the winners/lucky people won't need to.

Of course there will be a lot of people in between, the world isn't black and white, but that's the gist of it anyway.

 

[RobBuona]

Why wouldn't MA want a completely random system? I'm afraid that's quite obvious. Everyone want to be a winner. If things are random, there are also winner and loser or lucky and unlucky people. The winners/lucky people will earn money and the losers/unlucky people will lose money and stop playing, thus MA will lose money as the loser/unlucky won't want to provide an income and the winners/lucky people won't need to.

Of course there will be a lot of people in between, the world isn't black and white, but that's the gist of it anyway.

You forgot one thing: addiction. That voice inside the player's head saying, "If I keep playing, I'm bound to hit big eventually!" That voice is how MA makes their money.

 

[Zacariaz]

You forgot one thing: addiction. That voice inside the player's head saying, "If I keep playing, I'm bound to hit big eventually!" That voice is how MA makes their money.

Partially maybe, but you forget that not everyone can afford to be a big spender and can't afford to keep losing.

 

[RobBuona]

Partially maybe, but you forget that not everyone can afford to be a big spender and can't afford to keep losing.

Which categories of player are you hoping to attract with the playing cost Entropia has compared to any other MMO game on the market?
The Planet Calypso player tends to be older and more affluent than the traditional MMO gamer. We will continue to pursue this target audience.

Any more questions?

The thing about addiction is that it exceeds rationalization. People who are addicted may clearly be fighting a losing battle, but that is irrelevant in their mind. They'll spend way more than they should in hopes of hitting big. But, of course, most will end up losing more than they hit.

 

[sdragonfire]

Knight Riders car is deciding what loot we get?

By the way, why would this be a testament to the stupidity of ALL participants?

OMG it all makes sence now! KAT (KITs evil twin) dropped the scanners!!

 

[aridash]

My guess is they use some lame ass gambling software they ripped off a slot machine somewhere and muddy/modify the output by constant daily manual manipulations as they see fit -- Voila, a "dynamic" loot system that nobody can figure out.

the system behaves in a manner so close to fruit machines, i've long been convinced they borrowed or reimplemented algorithms from them.

 

[sdragonfire]

the system behaves in a manner so close to fruit machines, i've long been convinced they borrowed or reimplemented algorithms from them.

 

[Huskie]

Loot is JUST LIKE an elephant with 6 legs which repair themselves over time. Check out these numbers to prove it!

0111100101101111011101010010000001100001011100100110010100100000011000010010000001100100011010010110001101101011

OMG! Genius!! It all fits together perfectly now!

Seriously though, yeah, that's how I read all of R4TT3X's brilliant loot theories, as well.


Oh, and I love it how he comes up with all these wild theories and numbers based on the results of a whooping 2 days worth of mining.

 

[Slaiine]

The OP is forgetting one very important time-proven fact: Those wankers at MA are utterly incapable of devising a system as complicated as you suggest.

My guess is they use some lame ass gambling software they ripped off a slot machine somewhere and muddy/modify the output by constant daily manual manipulations as they see fit -- Voila, a "dynamic" loot system that nobody can figure out.

lol. I see you read Hanne's Q&A !

 

[Mega]

So have you seen that film ?

 

[Parlog]

at a hidden secret spot on the deepest point of the westeudorian ocean you even can hear the scanning sound, when Kit scans the surroundings!