Info: *** WoF 2010 WARSHEET ***

What a thrilling 3 hours on Treasure Island today... here are the numbers (checked 3 times using my chat logs and logs/excel sent from the other Judges)

RUSSIA 808 - CANADA 418

ENGLAND 729 - FRANCE 578

And the best for last...

DACH 694 - USA 585

Here's how it happened before I get strung up by my countrymen When the dust settled, we had this score:
USA 585
DACH 579

That alone is one of the closest matches I can recall
DACH Loot = 3530
USA Loot = 2592

So DACH gets the +15 Loot Bonus...
DACH 594
USA 585

Add in +100 for the win...
DACH 694
USA 585

See you in the morning

Sheesh we knew the US v DACH match was gonna be hard fought and it looks like it lived up to that.


Well done to all teams

feels good it definately does!

This just turned semi pairs distribution into lottery -) With USA sitting at 5-6th qualifying position and their potential to change things in 1 match, with other teams being so close in points... whatever place you aim for, it can easily throw you against the opponent you were trying hard to avoid -) It's not tactical planning anymore. It's gambling!

But then Australia, Benelux, Sweden, Finland, Italy and Portugal are yet to play their matches too. Let's wait and see if they can make things even more confusing -)

Sweden - BeNeLux
764 - 611
(unconfirmed after a good long sleep)
Thank you judges again for a great work!!

Lars Sebra said:

Sweden - BeNeLux
764 - 611
(unconfirmed after a good long sleep)
Thank you judges again for a great work!!

Click to expand...

Close... but we would much rather err on the side of caution and verify later - which has been done:

[br]Click to enlarge[/br]

Everyone that was declared a winner is still a winner, which is good I think.

OP is updated with pretty graphics... check it out

Rayne Jade said:

Everyone that was declared a winner is still a winner, which is good I think.

Click to expand...

I spoke too soon... but I can admit where it all went wrong so bear with me.

After PMing back and forth with Mack, I could see there was something wrong somewhere. Mack had one score for USA and I had something different. We are pretty much close by so we talked on the phone and viola!! Found the problem.

The Excel spreadsheet we use for scoring and tabulating has an upper section for mob totals (globals) and PED totals. There were 7 Hogglo globals by Team USA... but the Excel only counted 6. The formula was not altered. My Excel file has 13 tabs: 1 for each team in Stage 4 and the 13th is for totals for the Stage. No other workbook in the file had that problem, so it is a mystery. But like all good mysteries, this one was solved.

RAW TOTALS:

USA - 594
DACH - 577

Add in the +15 for high loot to DACH and we get:

USA - 594
DACH - 592

Winner = USA by 2 points.

USA - 694
DACH - 592

I do sincerely apologize for this drama and for any mental/emotional instabilities that result from it. This was not a result of too many teams, too many globals, etc. It was an error that I will claim as my own because... simply put... I should have noticed that.

The OP is updated with the corrected scores and we will get a replacement "pretty one" up as soon as we can. I've said it before: We strive to get it right. Now it is.

Crap deleted, error by me, sorry

Well, shit happens. Funny that a single Bristlehog could have "changed the world".

There is just one thing i dont get ...

Rayne Jade said:

... (checked 3 times using my chat logs and logs/excel sent from the other Judges) ...

Click to expand...

Rayne Jade said:

... After PMing back and forth with Mack, I could see there was something wrong somewhere. ...

Click to expand...

Nevertheless, keep up the good work. Next time we´ll make sure there are enough points difference for easier calculation.

Rayne Jade said:

And the best for last...

DACH 694 - USA 585

Here's how it happened before I get strung up by my countrymen When the dust settled, we had this score:
USA 585
DACH 579

That alone is one of the closest matches I can recall
DACH Loot = 3530
USA Loot = 2592

So DACH gets the +15 Loot Bonus...
DACH 594
USA 585

Click to expand...

Rayne Jade said:

The Excel spreadsheet we use for scoring and tabulating has an upper section for mob totals (globals) and PED totals. There were 7 Hogglo globals by Team USA... but the Excel only counted 6. The formula was not altered. My Excel file has 13 tabs: 1 for each team in Stage 4 and the 13th is for totals for the Stage. No other workbook in the file had that problem, so it is a mystery. But like all good mysteries, this one was solved.

RAW TOTALS:

USA - 594
DACH - 577

Add in the +15 for high loot to DACH and we get:

USA - 594
DACH - 592

Winner = USA by 2 points.

USA - 694
DACH - 592

Click to expand...

Wonder how the excel bug with the USA hogglo globals decreased our score by 2. This all smells way to fishy to believe.

Rayne Jade said:

No other workbook in the file had that problem, so it is a mystery. But like all good mysteries, this one was solved.

Click to expand...

Waht makes this to a good mystery ? that USA finaly won ?
grab some history books maybe u can turn Vietnam into a Victory too

Over and out of WOF

More water on Aurora's mills

Vince Amarillo said:

Wonder how the excel bug with the USA hogglo globals decreased our score by 2. This all smells way to fishy to believe. Over and out.

PS
grab some history books maybe u can turn Vietnam into a Victory too

Click to expand...

Good catch seeing that, hope Rayne can comment.
No need to see anything fishy though, they do the best they can and judging this madness is a shitload of work.

Oh the drama... -) this is definitely the most exciting match of the year so far -) DACH has shown their ability to cause USA trouble from the very first match of Qualifying round and they keep doing it now.

I won't deny wishing USA really won this one, as it would make things more predictable for us. But I definitely wouldn't like to see DACH mistreated. Hope everything gets checked and explained, so it comes to the score both teams can accept whatever the outcome is.

Pirx Danford said:

Good catch seeing that, hope Rayne can comment.
No need to see anything fishy though, they do the best they can and judging this madness is a shitload of work.

Click to expand...

RJ did comment/explain it. As I said at another place: I trust RJ.

I am member of team DACH as well as member of the judge team. And I know the pressure when a bunch of potent teams are in competition at the same time.

I got the records too (if my main chat log was working correct). I can double check the numbers. I am pretty sure about the result: I will find out that RJ and Mack did a good job. But probably someone will trust me more because I am one from team DACH (loosers ) while RJ and Mack are from USA.

I don't want to have a wide debate about this issue. We have rules stated by the organizer Hurrikane. Everybody can (and should!) know this rules. Everybody who takes part in this competition automatically accepted the rules. If there are doubts about the results given by the judge team we can and will eliminate this doubts. No need to interloop with political discussions.

Jamira said:

RJ did comment/explain it. As I said at another place: I trust RJ.

I am member of team DACH as well as member of the judge team. And I know the pressure when a bunch of potent teams are in competition at the same time.

I got the records too (if my main chat log was working correct). I can double check the numbers. I am pretty sure about the result: I will find out that RJ and Mack did a good job. But probably someone will trust me more because I am one from team DACH (loosers ) while RJ and Mack are from USA.

I don't want to have a wide debate about this issue. We have rules stated by the organizer Hurrikane. Everybody can (and should!) know this rules. Everybody who takes part in this competition automatically accepted the rules. If there are doubts about the results given by the judge team we can and will eliminate this doubts. No need to interloop with political discussions.

Click to expand...

Absolutely as if it is not transparent with tracker records, human error in interpretation has to occur at some stage.
A mighty dedication and task by the organisers cheers to them!
Xaph
WoF Ausssies

aaaaahhhhh the team america



they know how to win even when loose

Vince Amarillo said:

Wonder how the excel bug with the USA hogglo globals decreased our score by 2. This all smells way to fishy to believe.



Waht makes this to a good mystery ? that USA finaly won ?
grab some history books maybe u can turn Vietnam into a Victory too

Over and out of WOF

Click to expand...

haha 577 - 579 best posting

what a joke in wof history

tdurre01 said:

It Seems USA Is Going To Destroy You All MUHAHAHAHAHA

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oh u proud of that funny guy

Come on guys, think twice before posting.

Judges are fair -no matter which country they come from-. No one of them will force one team to win by doing bad. If differences are present, lets proof it and let us live with it whatever comes out at the end.

No one of Judges or WoF Board has a profit by doing wrong - in the opposite they will destroy whole WoF by manipulating scores. So I am sure they have *not* done so.

Calling 3 different scores in short shows only one thing:

Don't say a word about scores before all math is done. Better waiting a few days longer for scores as to have a disput like we have now.

So please all calm down now.

Team DACH is not known to be bad loosers. If all math are correct now, 2 points below USA is *not* loosing in my eyes.

And if there are proofings of all math again, so lets wait, see results, and then let's go ahead.

Listen to this guy, he is totally right.

Though it may be hard to accept, the judges are only human, so mistakes can happen. No need for unheeded suspicions.

Danton said:

Come on guys, think twice before posting.

Judges are fair -no matter which country they come from-. No one of them will force one team to win by doing bad. If differences are present, lets proof it and let us live with it whatever comes out at the end.

No one of Judges or WoF Board has a profit by doing wrong - in the opposite they will destroy whole WoF by manipulating scores. So I am sure they have *not* done so.

Calling 3 different scores in short shows only one thing:

Don't say a word about scores before all math is done. Better waiting a few days longer for scores as to have a disput like we have now.

So please all calm down now.

Team DACH is not known to be bad loosers. If all math are correct now, 2 points below USA is *not* loosing in my eyes.

And if there are proofings of all math again, so lets wait, see results, and then let's go ahead.

Click to expand...

I trust in Mack as well as in RJ, although he is in USA support. And I am sure both of them trust in me, although I am in DACH support.

It is correct: Any fake or bad result would destroy WoF. Everyone in judge team is aware of this!

Everyone pushes for the scores even before the guns stop smoking so dont go complaining if a liitle booboo is made in the heat of the moment.

The mistake was picked up so why the prob

The Excel spreadsheet we use for scoring and tabulating has an upper section for mob totals (globals) and PED totals. There were 7 Hogglo globals by Team USA... but the Excel only counted 6. The formula was not altered. My Excel file has 13 tabs: 1 for each team in Stage 4 and the 13th is for totals for the Stage. No other workbook in the file had that problem, so it is a mystery

Click to expand...

I have used Excel extensively virtually every next day since day one and over the last decade even longer the odd unexeplained calculation, macro etc happens. (Usually when backtracking you find out why BUT sometimes )

Most teams should have someone that actually keep track of their own scores.

My hat goes off to Hurri Rj and the few that help out. It is a monumental task to keep track of this rather enormouse event with very little help as far as I see. *hides behind tree in case a job comes my way*

Keep up the great work

Oh yeah

up the Aussies

Jung Aussie wof

If anyone does not feel the scores are correct, you should have chat logs and screenshots to verify yourself.

Jamira said:

RJ did comment/explain it. As I said at another place: I trust RJ.

I am member of team DACH as well as member of the judge team. And I know the pressure when a bunch of potent teams are in competition at the same time.

I got the records too (if my main chat log was working correct). I can double check the numbers. I am pretty sure about the result: I will find out that RJ and Mack did a good job. But probably someone will trust me more because I am one from team DACH (loosers ) while RJ and Mack are from USA.

I don't want to have a wide debate about this issue. We have rules stated by the organizer Hurrikane. Everybody can (and should!) know this rules. Everybody who takes part in this competition automatically accepted the rules. If there are doubts about the results given by the judge team we can and will eliminate this doubts. No need to interloop with political discussions.

Click to expand...

Maybe I was unclear - in no way I find this fishy myself.
What I meant was the loss of 2 points of DACH from 579 to 577,
probably I failed to see the explanation by RJ about this and kindly ask anyone who saw it to give me a link to it.
For whatever reason this happened I am sure that after having found a mistake earlier RJ will now have quadruplechecked everything and I believe the result is final.
A political discussion would be stupid, but pointing out and inquiring should be no problem.

Edit: AH she commented

Rayne Jade said:

I don't know what else to say to be honest. I can't simply discount the 7th Hogglo from USA simply because the excel formula had an error. It did happen so it counts. The same thing would happen if a team posted a screenshot of a global that we missed. It would count.

To address the 2 point change in DACH's score: a Furor Adept was scored as a 4-point instead of a 2-point. Human error - my fault. Several Furor's for USA were scored incorrectly as well, but even after corrections were made USA Support still capped so that does not change anything.

There is no conspiracy here. Damn sure nothing should be vented toward Mack. Sure he is from USA and on USA Support, but I can assure you that he is 100% unbiased when judging and verifying scores. However, coming from me that probably will not matter to some of you. Anyone that wants my records from the match, just ask. I consider it ALL public information. Anyone that was hunting during that 3 hour period can see all globals anyway so there is nothing to hide.

All I can do is strive to get it correct. That will not change.

Time zones and RL affect our verification processes. As a result, expect verified scores to be posted no sooner than 3 days after the matches are over. I will damn sure NOT jump the gun in the future until the process is absolutely complete.

DACH has fielded a very impressive team and I would hate to see this incident cause anyone to leave the WoF. DACH is still in 1st place in the Group and will almost certainly advance to the SemiFinals.

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okay i want team Dach to stop the discussion and beat up their couches instead. (this also goes for the german WoF Forum)

If a loss by 2 points against USA is reality, so be it. Judges made a critical mistake, we cannot change it, they pledged betterment and we have their apologies.

I ordered a complete comented list of globals of both teams together with info about Boni and all from RJ and want him to post it here on the forums.

Emotions went high in the last 5 hours and i want team DACH to CALM DOWN! The judges made an awesome job in many many matches during the years. So now they should get the chance to show a professionality that has the same level as the tension and "hype" of this years WoF!

Par over and out!

I know RJs raw data will give more of a sense of closure to everyone, but figured I'd post my info here as well. Below is the information that is generated by a scoring parser I wrote. I take this information and then run through the logs manually as well to verify as much as possible. This is just my means of checking myself, not the official scoring system. I compare this against the official spreadsheets that all the judges help to produce and then go after any differences I find, correcting whichever side is in error (and yes, many times it is an error on my side).

I know that I am from the United States and a member of the USA team, but I was a judge before I started competing and that remains my main focus in WOF. I do my best to stay impartial in everything I do related to WOF. Once my individual match is over, the judges hat goes on and then it is just getting down to finding the correct numbers. This week the correction I submitted changed the results of the USA/DACH match. The round before I submitted corrections that took points AWAY from the USA team. As Jamira has posted, all the judges know that any deception on our part would ruin the best event in game. We just want to do our best to get the numbers right and get them posted as quickly as possible. These two objectives don't always work well together.

My raw data....you are welcome to compare it against your own chat log (please note that the bonus mob points get lumped into the Main bonus below regardless of whether main or support get the bonus mob).

Match: USA-694 V. DACH-592 (USA=594+0+100, DACH=577+15+0)

Country: USA - 594
Country: DACH - 577

Country: USA - Globals: (Main) 9 7 3 3 1 1 (Support) 39 2 17 2 (Bonus) 1
PED Amounts: 2645, 6106
Main Point :219:, Support Points :200:, Main Bonus :150:, Support Bonus :25:Total Points :594:
Global Amounts:
Big Letomie : 68 68 96 156 470 148 112 57 99
Hogglo : 53 76 57 157 94 69 57
Big Frescoquda : 236 92 110
Globster : 122 70 65
Small Letomie : 61
Small Frescoquda: 52
Big Furor : 51 272 90 56 157 56 167 56 98 154 81 220 58 390 53 68 100 80 102 67 68 162 53 55 136 68 78 152 50 51 106 110 178 64 66 58 55 112 58
Bristlehog : 84 69
Small Furor : 74 52 66 53 191 52 65 139 238 70 122 54 53 141 60 85 163
Cornundacauda : 56 73
Bonus Foul : 90

Country: DACH - Globals: (Main) 7 19 2 1 1 1 (Support) 15 3 24 1 (Bonus) 1
PED Amounts: 3530, 3750
Main Point :284:, Support Points :118:, Main Bonus :150:, Support Bonus :25:Total Points :577:
Global Amounts:
Big Letomie : 172 140 100 76 76 89 71
Hogglo : 95 104 75 175 84 486 70 100 65 60 220 75 129 86 67 62 64 145 68
Big Frescoquda : 88 64
Globster : 96
Small Letomie : 107
Small Frescoquda: 221
Big Furor : 63 68 58 71 135 77 211 76 58 76 63 136 82 182 55
Bristlehog : 168 52 55
Small Furor : 56 55 61 105 101 68 63 107 82 50 54 60 140 78 65 211 119 86 58 53 83 53 54 66
Cornundacauda : 63
Bonus Foul : 73

Regards, Mack

P.S.

Understand that sometimes chat doesn't show a global for some people and therefore doesn't show up in all chat logs. This is why multiple chat logs are used to verify the globals. If you don't see a global reported above in your chat log, check with a team mate before coming in and setting fire to the place please

RJ always had the global count correct after checking 3 chat logs, it was just an excel glitch that wasn't counting one of the USA hogglos and one DACH furor that ended up in the wrong column (low maturity versus big maturity) that were the difference.

-Mack

Dispute settled USA won