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Is MU taken into account when loot is generated?

A

Arch

Old Alpha
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Drake Bad Lands
Do you think MU is taken into account when loot is generated?

So, if it is, basically it wouldn't matter to hunt mobs with high mu drops or mine ores with high mu since it is already accounted for and you just get less of them. I am undecided but have my suspicions.

And, has the market value tool been part of the game since inception?
 
No and no.
 
As to the first question: We'll never know for sure. It's part of the secret sauce.
 
Not sure... but there are times I think they are. But sometime not really.. .
 
No. :)

We will never know for sure, but from programmers perspective only it would be a nightmare.
 
Wolverine Queen said:
[...], but from programmers perspective only it would be a nightmare.
Click to expand...



Why? :scratch2:

You already have a well established in-game structure which generates daily, weekly, and yearly MUs. So, generally the thing you’d have to do is to put a (TT + MU) variable where you had a TT variable before.

Can’t see programmers’ nightmares there... :dunno:
 
The first question has been asked before many times and the generally accepted answer is No, MU is not factored into loot.
Recently, I have doubted this greatly, and to be honest, I think it is an accidental bug that the developers haven't realized is there. It would definitely go a long way to explaining the very very strange economic balance the game has adopted recently. And since 97% of all developers and programmers in the world are prima donnas, it is not surprising that they completely ignore reports of such bugs also. (BTW, 98.5% of sysadmins are prima donnas too).

As for the in-game graphs, if I remember correctly they were made available to the player base a bit less than 30 months ago, but MindArk [claim to] have always had that information internally.
 
if mu is taken in account when loot is generated, we are fucking, because never we will have a chance to profit a long term, and the intelligence, techniques and strategy will be shit+ I will hope that you are wrong!
 
From records of tt in/out for bomb, probe, amp, ammo burned the payback over long term i think hasn't changed (currently sitting at about 87%). Thats not including armour, fap, and other tool decay though, but this decay doesn't seem to be returned and is the charge by MA/FPC afaik.
It does feel like swings in loot are bigger though and the cycle (ped turnover) to see the average return is longer now.
 
loot returned is independant of markup but I will say this ma does things to meddle with what your going to get back. Look at the lyst and oil found at almost all depths in mining. Back in the old times that wasn't much of a issue, but I guess ma felt it best to push miners towards L or eat less mu, tier up, etc... Sorry to ramble but thats one thing for sure I can tell you where loot and markup were affected, but over all % back of costs (ammo, amps, bomb/probe, craft mats )floats between 85 to 90%. Doubtful that we see armor and fap back.


kosmos
 
Interesting thread. The fact that all items have market data on them - does that not suggest that MA tracks it maybe more than we think??
 
I suspect the 1st value is a yes actually lol. Then again, I also believe return %-ages are stored in userprofiles and things like deposit behaviour and support-harrassment have influence on it over time. The house always wins even markup-wise on average is my experience at least.

Last one is definately a no.
 
MARKET VALUE isn't determined on looting. The MARKET determines the value. That's determined by supply and demand.

MA can control supply though. They can play with drop rates to make the market value go up or down, and they can change things around as they see fit to encourage us to demand more of a particular good. But we, the market, ultimately determine the price. If MA doesn't like where the price is going, they can simply adjust the drop rate.

So it's not really a "chicken vs egg" case. They set some drop rate, we give it a market value, then MA adjusts the drop rate as they see fit.
 
Spend 10k PEDs hunting Furor and see how many Cleavers you get.

Then spend 10k PEDs hunting Feffoids and see how many Korss you get.

That should give you the answer to your question.

Clue: The answer is no.
 
Yes, From the ath list, most that i know of did not include items with markup. Also alot of the older ul uber stuff didnt loot in hofs or aths. Example modmercs wernt looted in 15k hofs but in small globals.
 
DoubleWolf said:
MARKET VALUE isn't determined on looting. The MARKET determines the value. That's determined by supply and demand.

MA can control supply though. They can play with drop rates to make the market value go up or down, and they can change things around as they see fit to encourage us to demand more of a particular good. But we, the market, ultimately determine the price. If MA doesn't like where the price is going, they can simply adjust the drop rate.

So it's not really a "chicken vs egg" case. They set some drop rate, we give it a market value, then MA adjusts the drop rate as they see fit.
Click to expand...

yes, thats what i mean, they maybe adjust the qtys as they see fit. so if mu is high one day for muscle oil maybe you get 47 instead of 50.. something like that
 
DoubleWolf said:
MARKET VALUE isn't determined on looting. The MARKET determines the value. That's determined by supply and demand.

MA can control supply though. They can play with drop rates to make the market value go up or down, and they can change things around as they see fit to encourage us to demand more of a particular good. But we, the market, ultimately determine the price. If MA doesn't like where the price is going, they can simply adjust the drop rate.

So it's not really a "chicken vs egg" case. They set some drop rate, we give it a market value, then MA adjusts the drop rate as they see fit.
Click to expand...

This. Good post.
 
Arch said:
yes, thats what i mean, they maybe adjust the qtys as they see fit. so if mu is high one day for muscle oil maybe you get 47 instead of 50.. something like that
Click to expand...

No, they would do the opposite. Excessively high markup means there's not enough supply in the game, so they would give you more muscle oil and less of something else. The TT value of your loot will remain constant unless MA changes their financial model. MA has no reason to care what the markup on your items are, because they are only in relation to the rarity of other items. If the markup on one item goes way up, it will go down on something else, or down a little bit on everything else.
 
Arch said:
yes, thats what i mean, they maybe adjust the qtys as they see fit. so if mu is high one day for muscle oil maybe you get 47 instead of 50.. something like that
Click to expand...

I think the drop rates probably get adjusted at each update. That's why you see some updates that don't really seem to fix anything at all.

So between each update, we loot the same consistent rate of stuff. Then before the next update, they re-evaluate the drop rates, and change them for the next period. It'd be too much of a hassle I think for them to monitor every item for every day. Also explains some of the limited run on items that we see. We get the update, the stuff starts dropping. New update comes along and the switch is turned off.

But some items aren't easy for them to control with just drop rates. So they have to come up with other ways of increasing the supply.

Take foul bones, for example. The markup was around 500% a year ago. Not too many people hunted them, even though the demand was high from tailors. I'd say the allowed drop rate was pretty high as well since they came in nearly every loot. But you couldn't increase the supply on them because it would throw the individual loots off. So they introduced the iron challenges on foul to get people to hunt them. Now bones are down half of what they were. The drop rate stayed the same, but we increased the supply simply by hunting them more.
 
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