Is MA doing illegal stuff?

[SKULL]

about to run, not much time, I used mt1000 with range enhancer 1 range enhancer 3 range enhancer 9,.
it went from unenhanced normal stats to 1000metres average putting them on,. actually it got above 1000metres, thats reason it went to 5average, it reseted when went over 1000 from 0 and up, but the finder not telling, that what I complain about.

reported allready .

this guy said he used range enhancers
but why the complaining about depth i dont get

range enhancer dont help you with depth
or am i wrong

 

[psychnosiz]

which is that the virtual ownership is vested in the avatar, not the player

avatar = player.
you cannot dispute that.

if anything happens to a virtual character RL laws rise above EULAs.

for example: a german? case in which two aged people played VIRTUAL avatars in a VIRTUAL roleplay enviroment and acted in a way which is illegal IRL were also condemned IRL.

can you imagine Mr Jacobs calling MA HQ about some of his high priced properties and they'd just swing him off "sorry we only talk to ND"?

 

[cduser]

*deleted*

 

[Darkewulfe]

How would we know if they were? 'tis not like they open their offices and their books to the common folk on a daily basis

 

[Fizbinthemagi]

this guy said he used range enhancers
but why the complaining about depth i dont get

range enhancer dont help you with depth
or am i wrong

did not even think about that, read about the depth issue, and i guess my mind changed range into depth for me. tomkat, can u clarify was it a range enhancer or depth?

range enhancers increase your search radius, probly at the cost of depth

depth enhancers increase your depth search at the cost of being less eco

atleast this is how i understand them!

 

[Xavier_Jr]

Unfortunately, i think is not exist any regulation about this. The only thing is first you must testing, and if goes good then you can playing again, or if go bad you must to stop of play the new ways that MA can offer to us.


Gold Rule: Testing, and if works, use it; if not, stopped!

 

[mandu]

Here in Canada, there are very few reasons that a company MUST give a refund for a service or product. If they give you no guarantee or waranty, it is only through their own good will that a refund, exchange, or credit will be given.

Having said that, any reputable vendor will offer refunds for unsatisfactory products or services.

I don't know what the Swedish laws are like, or if they even apply to MA though.

 

[Skippie]

hey dum dum,

ma is not forcing you to use ma109 at cnd.

ma is not forcing you to deposit.

ma is not forcing you to play their game.

kind regards,

skippie

 

[Shadowsong]

avatar = player.
you cannot dispute that.

Oh, but I do dispute that.

if anything happens to a virtual character RL laws rise above EULAs.

EULA is also a RL law, but as a contract of adhesion, it is less likely to stand against other established legal challenges, so yes, a EULA is in no way the final word.

for example: a german? case in which two aged people played VIRTUAL avatars in a VIRTUAL roleplay enviroment and acted in a way which is illegal IRL were also condemned IRL.

Any more detail on this? I'd be very interested to know more about what they were prosecuted for - what illegal act did they perform?

can you imagine Mr Jacobs calling MA HQ about some of his high priced properties and they'd just swing him off "sorry we only talk to ND"?

I can imagine that would be a ..... colourful day

 

[RadlinLastway]

Here in Canada, there are very few reasons that a company MUST give a refund for a service or product. If they give you no guarantee or waranty, it is only through their own good will that a refund, exchange, or credit will be given.

Having said that, any reputable vendor will offer refunds for unsatisfactory products or services.
I don't know what the Swedish laws are like, or if they even apply to MA though.

Mostly the same but the EULA makes them all unusable to use as a ground for a lawsuit. Even the rights of "distansköpslagen" the distance purchase law, is waved upon accepting the EULA.

EULA is also a RL law, but as a contract of adhesion, it is less likely to stand against other established legal challenges, so yes, a EULA is in no way the final word.

The EULA is not a law but a contract. Hard to use the rights you already have waved upon accepting the EULA (the contract) as a ground for a lawsuit isn't it.

for example: a german? case in which two aged people played VIRTUAL avatars in a VIRTUAL roleplay enviroment and acted in a way which is illegal IRL were also condemned IRL.

Some laws and rights you can wave using contracts. BUT if you use the internet to commit a RL crime such as money laundry you can still get sued/charged/put in prison. The rights you wave are those that YOU have against MA. Not the rights other players/governments/countries have against you.

 

[Joat]

Do a support case (which I guess you have) and see what they say.
If they find a bug, and you suffer from it, who knows, you might get
compensated...

Info for some others:
• MA has(had?) 57 employees.
• EU were "judged" as non-gambling before tier-system came. But this isn't
set in stone, the "general impression" of EU can change at anytime.

 

[Tomkat]

It sucks that you spent money on an untested item, when you didn't know exactly how it worked and are now pissed about it; because it worked in a manner that you didn't expect..

It does sound like a bug that you got a couple of 5m claim depths; kinda like the y2k bug. It's like you were actually searching at 1005 meters, but it couldn't show you the 1000, because it doesn't normally go higher.

As for the Ferrari references - they're not even a legitimate way to compare the situation. Mindark did NOT tell you that the enhancer was going to last for 100 bombs, they did NOT say that you wouldn't find claims lower than 1k depth.
So in essence, they didn't tell you 'the ferrari goes 200mph when it only goes 20mph.'

But, honestly - you've been "selling out" to leave game - just about every time I've seen you ... for the last three years now.

If you feel like "It's a gamble, shit - pyramid scheme," then it could be time for you to actually cut the cord, to walk away, and really do what you've been talking about doing for years.

Good luck figuring out whatever it is that you're going to be doing - but my suggestion is to wait until there's a lot more testing done on these enhancers; before you buy them again and have another freak out.

I actually stopped wanting to quit and first started enjoying paying money for game last year,. allways been wining, but now I dont. not wanting to quit now.

 

[Tomkat]

I understand that... you missed my point, which is that the virtual ownership is vested in the avatar, not the player, and as you rightly point out, all the virtual objects, including avatars, are actually owned by MA/FPC in terms of their eula.

so is it leagal to give money like I did to Mindark freely without getting anything for it?

Is it leagal to make people pay for something they will never own?

 

[Ze-Tomb Raider]

so is it leagal to give money like I did to Mindark freely without getting anything for it?

Is it leagal to make people pay for something they will never own?

As long as they agree in my opinion it is perfectly legal especially because they have agreed to the terms and conditions of the EULA. YOu can even take money out from selling this that are owned by MA|FPC. I don't see the problem with paying for things you don't really own.

 

[Tomkat]

notice that I been twisting the thread few times during the posts.,

my bank manager says I can withdraw the deposit I made within few days MA have not gotten the money yet but they are only reserved for them,.

Why not do it as I have not gotten anything for the money,. I deposit and I have gotten ped on my ingame account witch is not really owned by me but owned by MA.

 

[Magyar Republic]

so is it leagal to give money like I did to Mindark freely without getting anything for it?

Is it leagal to make people pay for something they will never own?

Its not leagal. Because leagal isnt a word, unless of course its a massive typo for Seagal, which is only a word if youre talking about this guy:

Honestly, if you want to talk about the niceties of law, and what is legal or not legal, you would benefit from a spell checker. This isnt a question of poor English skills. Its a question of apparent unwillingness to do a little bit of extra work to overcome an obvious weakness.

Which is of course what got you into this mess in the first place.

 

[Malin]

What is wrong with some of you people?"

I cant believe how people are acting on this forum now, its just outright trolling, with hurtful words, insults.

im ashamed of alot of you in here, people with good reps, even people from high ranking socs, come here and act like a 14 year old troll.

Its pretty clear abekat tryed the new enhancers, they clearly state what they should do, and they did not. They are bugged and peds where lost, i would feel scammed to. Of curse its best handled with by support. but he has every right to complain here on the forum as well, and it is a very good warning to others as well.

 

[RadlinLastway]

so is it leagal to give money like I did to Mindark freely without getting anything for it?

Is it leagal to make people pay for something they will never own?

Yes its legal for you to pay for the "renting" or the "service" they offer without really getting anything for it.

notice that I been twisting the thread few times during the posts.,

my bank manager says I can withdraw the deposit I made within few days MA have not gotten the money yet but they are only reserved for them,.

Why not do it as I have not gotten anything for the money,. I deposit and I have gotten ped on my ingame account witch is not really owned by me but owned by MA.

If you try to tell your bank manager to stop the payment after you receive PED's on you pedcard I think MA will sue you for violating the EULA and for scamming them for Virtual funds. Since they can prove you signed the EULA (a contract) and then acted upon that contract by depositing money and then violating it by stopping an agreed payment, they will sue. And they will win their case in every court in Sweden and you will probably be in some trouble so I suggest you don't try that. Don't forget that they would probably immediately lock your account "pending investigation" until the courts have done theirs and they somehow got paid. And unless the deposited amount is allot more then your avatar and everything on it is worth it doesn't sound like a good idea.

 

[SKULL]

as i said before he had a theory and tried it
but he made a few errors

he used range enhancers for instance
then dont complain about no finds at more depth then before
used depth enhancers or better yet use a better finder

its not ma's fault

no trolling here or harsh words just the way i see it
just a friendly discussion

 

["Rill"]

this guy said he used range enhancers
but why the complaining about depth i dont get

range enhancer dont help you with depth
or am i wrong

You are right. Range enhancers have nothing to do with depth. And IMHO the complaint comes more from what the guy has spent in game and got little to show for it. How many times have we seen that said.

Perhaps the Credit Card interest has caught up with him.

 

[True Juan]

To Danielle:
And who is going to test it??? The players...Ever think of that?

All we know now is just work of players that lost peds in the past.

Simple math:
(Testing = Money) + (TestMonkeys = Players) = Loss for players / Gain for MA


TJ

 

[Menace]

deposits will not be returned, however feel free to deposit more, just to withdraw it!

There is nothing illegal about enhancer's not having a condition bar!

Well.... theoretically there is. This now falls under the gambling issue as now you buy an item that can work for XXXX uses or XX uses. With the loot, all MA had to do was prove that there is an average return, an algorithm (or several), and that players are able to influence their return %'s in order for it to be considered "dynamic". However, MA has stated themselves that enhancers break "randomly" which we as players have no influence over whatsoever. Therefore, even as per swedish law... purchasing an enhancer to increase your chances at profiting BUT that enhancer can break at random means that we're taking a gamble by purchasing that enhancer.... now.... if our skill levels affected how long that enhancer would last for... things would be a different story.

 

[Fizbinthemagi]

Perhaps the Credit Card interest has caught up with him.

This is why i use prepaid credit cards, sure it cost me 5 dollars to load it, but in the long run its very much worth it, no over drafting the bank account and no high interest rates! and most important its the most secure way to deposit into entropia, there is no social security numbers or anything that could be used to steal your identity, well except for your name, which you don't even have to use your real name!

 

[Fizbinthemagi]

Well.... theoretically there is. This now falls under the gambling issue as now you buy an item that can work for XXXX uses or XX uses. With the loot, all MA had to do was prove that there is an average return, an algorithm (or several), and that players are able to influence their return %'s in order for it to be considered "dynamic". However, MA has stated themselves that enhancers break "randomly" which we as players have no influence over whatsoever. Therefore, even as per swedish law... purchasing an enhancer to increase your chances at profiting BUT that enhancer can break at random means that we're taking a gamble by purchasing that enhancer.... now.... if our skill levels affected how long that enhancer would last for... things would be a different story.

not gonna argue here, but i would like to point out that some people have stated(with no proof that i know of) that tier rates effect the randomness of the enhancers breaking, if this is true, which only time and dedication can prove, then you are back at the player being able to influence how long the enhancers last. Maybe it's just me, but i feel that this is the case! if you have any information to prove or disprove this please share, as i have not even started using them yet, due to them having such an insane MU(which is slowly getting better!)

 

[Spinage]

Well.... theoretically there is. This now falls under the gambling issue as now you buy an item that can work for XXXX uses or XX uses. With the loot, all MA had to do was prove that there is an average return, an algorithm (or several), and that players are able to influence their return %'s in order for it to be considered "dynamic". However, MA has stated themselves that enhancers break "randomly" which we as players have no influence over whatsoever. Therefore, even as per swedish law... purchasing an enhancer to increase your chances at profiting BUT that enhancer can break at random means that we're taking a gamble by purchasing that enhancer.... now.... if our skill levels affected how long that enhancer would last for... things would be a different story.

All MA have to do for any authoritive check would be simply prove there is an algorithm for an average ammount of uses before it breaks. Not at all different from loot being random with an average return %.

People who say these enhancers are bad, or should be illegal due to being random, do consider tha by this awful logic, the following is true:

• Loot should be illegal
• Damage dealt should be illegal
• Critical hits should be illegal
• Damage received should be illegal
• Skillgains should be illegal

Pretty much the whole game should be illegal. Until people realise that, like every other random thing in the game, there is still an average "predictable" outcome. Is it me alone who sees this as common sense?

P.S, O.P, I think it is most definitely a bug that you were getting 5m claims, and this is the point you must stress in your support case for any chance of success.

 

[blackhawk77g]

Well

btw, this topic is not general about enhancers, it is about if it is possible to get all money I depositted back somehow? many people says gambling is illegal in sweden etc. and some place of the world, but how can this game exsist? nothing but gamble and shit, Pyramid Scheme,.

I been a very happy user and loved the game and depositted 100s of thousands of peds into game,. but am I doing this because I am knowing less than something or someone?

This game isnt gambling, since gambling dosent allow you to gain skills.
Sorry you lost your money. But the same would be irl if I payed for a magazine subscription, you can end the subscription but you cannot return the magazines. Trully am sorry. Hope you can sell the ehancer for something and get something back.

 

[Fizbinthemagi]

All MA have to do for any authoritive check would be simply prove there is an algorithm for an average ammount of uses before it breaks. Not at all different from loot being random with an average return %.

People who say these enhancers are bad, or should be illegal due to being random, do consider tha by this awful logic, the following is true:

• Loot should be illegal
• Damage dealt should be illegal
• Critical hits should be illegal
• Damage received should be illegal
• Skillgains should be illegal

Pretty much the whole game should be illegal. Until people realise that, like every other random thing in the game, there is still an average "predictable" outcome. Is it me alone who sees this as common sense?

P.S, O.P, I think it is most definitely a bug that you were getting 5m claims, and this is the point you must stress in your support case for any chance of success.

This is exactly why the united states congress wont touch RCE games! The line Between Game/Casino/Investment is way to thin! From one perspective its easy to see how this game is considered gambling, on the other hand its very easy to see that this game is much like the stock market! and then you have those that dont deposit, which in turn this is just a game to them, with potential to make money(as in any other mmorpg, whether its legal or not to make money from them)!

 

[Magyar Republic]

I cant believe how people are acting on this forum now, its just outright trolling, with hurtful words, insults.

im ashamed of alot of you in here, people with good reps, even people from high ranking socs, come here and act like a 14 year old troll.

Its pretty clear abekat tryed the new enhancers, they clearly state what they should do, and they did not. They are bugged and peds where lost, i would feel scammed to. Of curse its best handled with by support. but he has every right to complain here on the forum as well, and it is a very good warning to others as well.

Well, there are bleeding hearts in every aspect of society, and one of them has surfaced here.

I have no pity for this individual. He is wrong in his incessant complaining. If you actually READ the thread instead of crying how someone is being ABUSED over the big bad intarwebz you will see how the community has tried to reason with him. Their efforts to talk some sense into him were simply put, disregarded or even twisted by this individual who is to be quite frank: desperate to be right.

Rather than pollute the thread with more "what ifs" --- hes done enough of that! --- I for one simply pointed out his already apparent tendency to rush into things, and the consequences of doing so.

Then miss High and Mighty Malin cruises into the thread and starts calling me and other folks names for doing so.

Well, Ive got thick skin. Your name calling doesnt hurt me. It does however make me laugh a bit. Thanks for the joke. Neg rep returned.