A player created planet?

[Atlan Leticron]

The simple answer is yes, provided they can proove they have the funds and a good idea for a planet that MA are willing to allow.

It's all very well in theory but in practice these kind of projects can lack direction, management control etc etc and can just implode on themselves. If you thought MA/FPC deadlines were bad then these kind of projects would be even worse. This is mainly due to peoples level of commitment and other responsibilities i.e. this kind of project would be ranked lower in their level of commitment.

I've worked on similar things and can say that from experience. To make it work you'd need strong leadership and backup plans for the lower committed i.e. what to do if something doesn't get done in time etc etc


It can work but the other problems would be with legal issues. With everyone working from different countries how wil that work?


The simplest approach would be to have a set number of core people. The hardcore dedicated team that really drive the project forward and a system that allows an outer circle of commitment i.e. part time/short time project workers.

The funding and paying for these workers would be quite expensive. Say 2 years of development, that's going to cost millions and the money has to be put in for the development otherwise you'll have a weak project that goes nowhere like postmoderna...

WOW, your quite the expert for someone who I never saw posting something in our dev forum.
Actualy I never did see on our forum at all.

If you dont have a clue of what is going on, than please keep your half assed comments to yourself thank you.

And if you think your such a expert, than I invite you to join our team and show what your made of and capable of.
We alway's can use a extra hand.

Yes I am part of the Planet Postmoderna development team, as a 3D designer, texture artist and concept artist.

Curently we do good and have some realy interesting progress going on.
You can understand that I cant go into detail for the obvious reasons.

But there is a lot more involved than most of you think.

And who say's we only focus on Entropia?

*EDIT*

For those who are interested, here is a link to our gallery

Postmoderna Gallery

Postmoderna Blog

And feel free to subscribe to our newsletter Here


Kind regards.
Ion

 

[NightwolfAA2k5]

I don't really think the planets are that great, because they share the loot pool with calypso, and that just means loot for everyone is bad... Unless there is a sudden influx of depositing players.

I have not seen a mention of any of these planets in local media, so there needs to be some kind of advertisement going on.

 

[billairboy]

I don't think players have the time and resources needed to do it. But if the planet had a "core" of talent people working on it as a full time job and some others working as a support team maybe it would work.

 

[matthew]

sure its possible, its just about having the drive, finding the right people, and being 100% dedicated till the end...

I think something like this could be an amazing project for not only the people involved but entropia, as well. Showing what is capable when a group of individuals join together.

I think each person in the team can also bring not only there skills to the table but the support from thier respected societies behind them, who can offer ideas, and also channel up information/work etc.

Ideas like this are not new since the first planet idea was introduced to use, but time and technoloiges have moved on since them. i think its a totally realistic thing to try for, or at lest look into.

but the truth is, it has never been done before, we would hit hundreds of set backs a long the way. would have a lot to over come to make it possible.

Were do i sign up

 

[J. Mandrake]

I wonder if MA gives teams polycount limitations, and texture sizes (as they would in a modeling contest for many other games.) I'm still open to joining a project, but it is kind of hard to work alone without direct contact to MA, and I haven't found a group of people who could both A) stay together and B) stay with MA. I've found that most groups would much rather just make their own game once they hear what MA is going to require of them. Even knowing (at least some) of those things, I'd still love to work on an actual planet partner project with another group of players. Whoever has a site/way to share files automatically gets a position of power as an organizer, I've found. So if anyone who has a site wants to get the ball rolling, I'll join in for sure and try to keep the project focused (I know what causes them to fall apart/break off from MA.) But I do know we would need a development site to get anything done.

 

[matthew]

MA used to say on their website, qualifiling planet partners receive a planet developers 'kit' which includes all the information and bits like that....


A lot of the techincal information has been removed from the 'Becoming a Planet Partner' area of the website now you just got to contact them for it.

but it was like,

Need a long term business plan, need to have a company/orginisation to build the planet, need a marketing stratergy, and funding for 2 years. (as far as i was concered MA would provide this orignal funding if you could prove you could do it, and you would pay them back afterwards. Although we would work for free, would have to secure some sort of funding for marketing and other outlays...)

 

[Rowdoc]

The question is.... do you think that MA would let a group of players, who organised themselves as a company, build one of the planets?.

I was just thinking that it could be possible for a group of individuals who had a certain amount of free time, to slowly build such a planet in their free time. The individuals would not even need to be in the same physical location (could all be done via skype, a forum, etc), as long as each person had clear tasks. As MA has in effect created the background system, then one person in each group could create the landscape, another the mobs, another missions, and then it would all come together like a puzzle. For example, I work as a lecturer at a university, so I have a lot of freedom as to what I do outside of my lecturing hours, so I reckon I could put in 20+ hours into such a project (a lot of which would just be taken out of my EU playing time).

So, the subquestions to this thread would be, how many people would you need to create such a system? (ie how many mobs could one person design in one month, how many land areas, etc). What kind of skills would be required to do such a thing? Would any money be required to start up such a system? (to me it appears the cost would be almost 0, provided that each individual had his own fairly decent computer)

The simple answer is obviously YES .
MA are running a business so new franchise/ buy in that would generate a new revenue stream would be welcomed.

However, I believe that the key to making a successful planet is to add something new that will interest the current players & bring in new one.
Rocktropia ( IMHO) is clear example of how not to do that. In my view is nothing more than Mod; new terrain , textures, skin with a few model coding tweaks.;I believe that is just not enough to bring players across.

Real reason for the post is to subscribe to it, as it interesting me what other have to say.

 

[J. Mandrake]

Mindark now KNOWS that they need money, I read their financial report. They expect the partners to do their advertising, obviously they want that sector to experience an increase. So I think that it would be as good a time as any to start developing.

What would be needed:
1) A development site/forum.
2) An agreement from the people working on it that they would not break from MA as long as MA stayed together as a company.
3) NDAs.
4) An agreement as to how funds would be divided between those working on it (for if/when funds do start coming in.)
5) Tasks would need to be assigned and updated frequently. I think deadlines, while annoying for a project like this, would be helpful.
6) Once development is underway, we can start exploring options to gather the required funding. If our team is dedicated and we have already put some work in, people would be less likely to give up once they realize that acquiring funds is not an easy process.

Sorry PPM, I didn't like the style, and I wasn't really aware of exactly what you wanted to do with your game when I signed up. Good luck with that project, though.

 

[matthew]

Mindark now KNOWS that they need money, I read their financial report. They expect the partners to do their advertising, obviously they want that sector to experience an increase. So I think that it would be as good a time as any to start developing.

What would be needed:
1) A development site/forum.
2) An agreement from the people working on it that they would not break from MA as long as MA stayed together as a company.
3) NDAs.
4) An agreement as to how funds would be divided between those working on it (for if/when funds do start coming in.)
5) Tasks would need to be assigned and updated frequently. I think deadlines, while annoying for a project like this, would be helpful.
6) Once development is underway, we can start exploring options to gather the required funding. If our team is dedicated and we have already put some work in, people would be less likely to give up once they realize that acquiring funds is not an easy process.

Sorry PPM, I didn't like the style, and I wasn't really aware of exactly what you wanted to do with your game when I signed up. Good luck with that project, though.

Yeah this would be important, and would set the ball rolling.

I think also we would need to sit down and discuess a 'road map' for the plant and company, we all have exertise in different fields but do we even know how to build a whole virtual planet, wha steps are included, what software, what code etc etc. we might each understand little bits so need to share that knowledge and teach each other as we learn together. Im sure know one in the team would have built a whole 3d planet as the tast askes before, so we will be learning together.

Would have to do a lot of research and work out step by step what we are required to achieve. And how we can go about doing that.

 

[Lykke]

I believe it is very simple; You got the money, you got a planet.

As mentioned, Postmoderna is run by Flapman, who is also a player in EU. They make continiously news about their indie projects developments, which goal is to become a planetpartner in EU.

The question is, if the project will be accepted by MA - but why shouldn't it?

No matter what then I far from agree, that the project is 'weak' as George says it; a lot of work and a nice group of people helping out gives a nice background knowledge and some neat relationships/friends around which might be used elsewere. Afterwards who knows, if the goal fails, maybe it will be a new 'game', strong enough to stand alone?

 

[Torlin]

The question is.... do you think that MA would let a group of players, who organised themselves as a company, build one of the planets?.

I was just thinking that it could be possible for a group of individuals who had a certain amount of free time, to slowly build such a planet in their free time. The individuals would not even need to be in the same physical location (could all be done via skype, a forum, etc), as long as each person had clear tasks. As MA has in effect created the background system, then one person in each group could create the landscape, another the mobs, another missions, and then it would all come together like a puzzle. For example, I work as a lecturer at a university, so I have a lot of freedom as to what I do outside of my lecturing hours, so I reckon I could put in 20+ hours into such a project (a lot of which would just be taken out of my EU playing time).

So, the subquestions to this thread would be, how many people would you need to create such a system? (ie how many mobs could one person design in one month, how many land areas, etc). What kind of skills would be required to do such a thing? Would any money be required to start up such a system? (to me it appears the cost would be almost 0, provided that each individual had his own fairly decent computer)

Are you serious?
You really think it's so easy to build a New Pllanet than you only need to work on it on your free time?
And you and some players could do all this with a forum or skype to speak each others?.
Have you ever think this is maybe a real job to do this?
You have to manage a team, you have to create a new kind of planet, Entropia Bis is not a good idea mate, you have to promote your new planet etc etc.
If you really can do it with some of your friends, how many time this could take you to create a planet?
I am really curious to know how you can do this

 

[kalanen]

edit: nevemindz0rz

 

[Luchomucho]

The question is.... do you think that MA would let a group of players, who organised themselves as a company, build one of the planets?.

I was just thinking that it could be possible for a group of individuals who had a certain amount of free time, to slowly build such a planet in their free time. The individuals would not even need to be in the same physical location (could all be done via skype, a forum, etc), as long as each person had clear tasks. As MA has in effect created the background system, then one person in each group could create the landscape, another the mobs, another missions, and then it would all come together like a puzzle. For example, I work as a lecturer at a university, so I have a lot of freedom as to what I do outside of my lecturing hours, so I reckon I could put in 20+ hours into such a project (a lot of which would just be taken out of my EU playing time).

So, the subquestions to this thread would be, how many people would you need to create such a system? (ie how many mobs could one person design in one month, how many land areas, etc). What kind of skills would be required to do such a thing? Would any money be required to start up such a system? (to me it appears the cost would be almost 0, provided that each individual had his own fairly decent computer)

Maybe they can start smaller and allow customize a LA with some parameters

 

[Torlin]

Maybe they can start smaller and allow customize a LA with some parameters

This is The Best idea of this post I think
Go Urugay, France is over lol

 

[NightwolfAA2k5]

If the larger mod teams for certain games can make modes for those games, then I'm quite sure our more technically inclined players could do the same.

Sandbox 2 isn't really that hard to learn, but to master

 

[Sarubaboon]

Are you serious?
You really think it's so easy to build a New Pllanet than you only need to work on it on your free time?
And you and some players could do all this with a forum or skype to speak each others?.
Have you ever think this is maybe a real job to do this?
You have to manage a team, you have to create a new kind of planet, Entropia Bis is not a good idea mate, you have to promote your new planet etc etc.
If you really can do it with some of your friends, how many time this could take you to create a planet?
I am really curious to know how you can do this

well... free time.... i teach at university, so all that is required of my job is that i spend a few hours a week teaching... then i have freedom to do whatever i want in my research, so time is something that i have in more supply than other people (its more a question of whether to pursue certain things of others with that time).... so, i could work on this project full time and still get my salary from university... hence for me it would be no problem...

then, it would be more the question of finding other people in similar circumstances, maybe people still at uni, etc, etc, who can put a significant number of hours into the project

then, according to another thread by Doer it seems that MA allows you minimal amount of coding, like, it appears they are pretty much just giving you the tools and not allowing you to do much outside of that.... so, all you need is to have a person who makes the new mobs, another one the terrain, etc, etc.... its appears to be more like a jigsaw really (as I said, because MA will not allow you to touch the engine)....

HOWEVER, and this is when I got a little disheartened, and referring to the post by Doer (someone whose opinions I have come to respect), they already got a lot into the project and realised that the time commitment was not in tune with the potential gains, ie, it would be better to invest in a LA than to pursue a planet project.... at that point I just gave up on the whole idea.... again, just based on one post....

Summarising, I know that I have the time, but if my time is better spent elsewhere, then there is no point even thinking of this anymore.... I'm surprised this thread has actually "re-opened" as I though several comments earlier on pretty much killed it really...

 

[matthew]

then, according to another thread by Doer it seems that MA allows you minimal amount of coding, like, it appears they are pretty much just giving you the tools and not allowing you to do much outside of that.... so, all you need is to have a person who makes the new mobs, another one the terrain, etc, etc.... its appears to be more like a jigsaw really (as I said, because MA will not allow you to touch the engine)....

HOWEVER, and this is when I got a little disheartened, and referring to the post by Doer (someone whose opinions I have come to respect), they already got a lot into the project and realised that the time commitment was not in tune with the potential gains, ie, it would be better to invest in a LA than to pursue a planet project.... at that point I just gave up on the whole idea.... again, just based on one post....

Yeah from what i understand it is like, drag and drop trees, air brush different ground textures/colours etc etc. Then we 3d model our mobs, and code the basic movement/attack patterns. from the info that used to be on the MA website, they do provide a huge amount of 'tools' because they can't have us playing with the main underlying 'system', its like a big sand box thing.
http://www.realityfactory.info/cms/ i can image building a planet is just like using this 'tool' to create a basic first person shooter, but scaled up 1000 times lol.

theres a lot of money in planet building, but a huge time investment for the approach we would be taking. We have to make our time worth while, during this phase, because we might never get to the end or it could be years before we do... We need to do it because we can teach each other new skills (coding, 3d modeling etc etc), learn differnt things, experience a new feild of work/study, and use the planet afterwards to continue forward that sort of idea maybe that anyone who wants a go can have ago, we can be proof that if people work together and believe they can do something, no matter how big, we can do it.

i think it was a uni that bought a LA or 2, to teach the students about business studies and give them ago at managing something them selves.

I think we need to do this, for the opportunities it opens to ourselfs, but also for the opportunities it allows us to open to other people right now, and years in to the future.

What im saying is, those students needed that opportunity that MA proved with the LA, maybe we could offer a better one , or atlest give those kids a discount lol.

i read EF a lot and see so many great ideas, people who want to launch these plans and ambitions but simpley can't because FPC doesn't offer them that oppertunity to shine very easily. They dont have the time, they dont have that personal touch we would have the way we would do things. And its nothing to do with money, invest in a great person, give them the oppertunity, and that investment looks after itself. It would be great if we could provide that on so many differnt levels, creating a truely players planet.

 

[J. Mandrake]

Well, I went ahead and made a forum site.

eppd.motionforum.net

I still need to add some categories and forums, not to mention a FAQ, but it should be decent enough for now to get some thought going on the project. I'll be a good Admin, I swear!

(I should get my new PC before we even really start working on this, and it should be more than capable of running EU, so I'll be able to test everything out.)

If you want to join, go ahead, post in the Personal section what you'd like to do. If you see any problems with the site, let me know.

 

[matthew]

Well, I went ahead and made a forum site.

eppd.motionforum.net

I still need to add some categories and forums, not to mention a FAQ, but it should be decent enough for now to get some thought going on the project. I'll be a good Admin, I swear!

(I should get my new PC before we even really start working on this, and it should be more than capable of running EU, so I'll be able to test everything out.)

If you want to join, go ahead, post in the Personal section what you'd like to do. If you see any problems with the site, let me know.

Ha Ha, yes. Good man!

Now, lets get to work.

People something say why bother if it will take x years to finish, i say, the sooner we start the sooner we finish

 

[J. Mandrake]

Ha Ha, yes. Good man!

Now, lets get to work.

People something say why bother if it will take x years to finish, i say, the sooner we start the sooner we finish

Agreed. I posted some ideas in the thread you had made over there. Also, there are more boards over there than it shows to unregistered guests, for anyone wondering. And I managed to get off an icrawl list! I'm so proud of myself. Anyways, at this point, we need MANY members, so whether or not you are artistically inclined, we still need people to work on the story and such. And if you ARE artistically inclined, we really need you! I might be able to model some basic stuff, but we still need people doing concepts, animations, textures, more models, etc. I don't think we'll be recruiting exclusively from the EU/EF community, but we should be made up largely of previous and current EU players so we don't have to explain the damn game to every member And we know what the playerbase is going to be looking for, and will try to meet those wants to our fullest capabilities.

http://eppd.motionforum.net, for those who missed it.

 

[Rowdoc]

Good work

 

[Atlan Leticron]

Well, I went ahead and made a forum site.

eppd.motionforum.net

I still need to add some categories and forums, not to mention a FAQ, but it should be decent enough for now to get some thought going on the project. I'll be a good Admin, I swear!

(I should get my new PC before we even really start working on this, and it should be more than capable of running EU, so I'll be able to test everything out.)

If you want to join, go ahead, post in the Personal section what you'd like to do. If you see any problems with the site, let me know.

I had a look at it and want to give you my personal opinion.

Sorry to say, but thats a project I would not step in.
For the simple reason, it don't looks professional.

I joined Planet Postmoderna for the simple fact that the setup is professional and mature.
When I browsed there forum for the first time I could see that the founder is having a professional setup and a serious approach to the project.

All bases are covered and thought out very well.
They also are very aware of whats involved in such a project.
Making models and a story line is only the tip of the ice berg.
Personally I think thats about 20% of the project.

And I think I have a pretty good idea what I talk about.
Currently I do a lot of modeling, texturing, art design and concept art for Postmoderna.

So my advice to you is:
Study such a project first before you start.
Get a good idea of what is involved and what the priority's are.
Set up a professional looking forum.

Or join us at Postmoderna

Just my thoughts.
Regards.
Ion

 

[matthew]

that project does look very cool indeed.

i think more interest is required before anything that fancy can be set up...

 

[NightwolfAA2k5]

The Planet Postmoderna website confuses me.
Is it actually going to be a Planet inside EU or not?

Is the current concept something that's going to be presented to MA, who are then going to take a look? or something else?

 

[matthew]

The Planet Postmoderna website confuses me.
Is it actually going to be a Planet inside EU or not?

Is the current concept something that's going to be presented to MA, who are then going to take a look? or something else?

I dont believe its been made using the Cryengine? there for it won't be compatable with the entropia system... unless its just calypso made in cryengine not the entire system? but i can image the graphics will have to be the same.

(i think thats how it works, forgive me if not lol)

and we all know how long it took for Caylpso to be converted.

I say this becuase i dont know how anyone would have access to the cryengine with out paying huge amounts of money OR being a planet partner already.

 

[Razormat]

I think Planet Postmoderna uses the Multiverse engine.
They probably would have to convert to the cryengine2 should they become a planet partner.

 

[ranpha]

I think Planet Postmoderna uses the Multiverse engine.
They probably would have to convert to the cryengine2 should they become a planet partner.

Thought they wanted to become a planetpartner yet lack the funds to do it . But if i see the blog it more looks like an old EU clone

 

[J. Mandrake]

Yeah, PPM confused the hell out of me. They said they weren't going to do the planet partner thing, but then they said they were. And @Atlan: I must have forgot to mention that some forums are not visible to unregistered guests, and those are the management/business boards. I figured we could show off our work to anyone who wanted to look, but keep the economic stuff private I'm very well aware of what is involved in this project, I've worked on one before. Granted, it fell apart when our "leader" left, but not before we were able to talk to MA and learn what would be required of us, and I definitely saw that the hard part wasn't necessarily the creative one. So don't call me unprofessional or say that I don't know what I'm doing. PPM has had more time to set up a good site, I started this a few days ago and we only have about 5 members, one of them being a test account I made. If you, for some reason, can't handle a blueish background, then I guess that would be a problem for now though.

 

[aridash]

Thought they wanted to become a planetpartner yet lack the funds to do it . But if i see the blog it more looks like an old EU clone

i think that is still their plan, but to their credit rather than sit around and talk they are taking steps to develop the concept so they can demostrate to investors. they have been going for 18mths or so, one would expect them to look more established, i recall it was pretty awful website for a long time. personally i think they will get to a point in their prototype an decide to just go on and develop a clone.

...I'm very well aware of what is involved in this project, I've worked on one before. Granted, it fell apart when our "leader" left, but not before we were able to talk to MA and learn what would be required of us, and I definitely saw that the hard part wasn't necessarily the creative one.

i think your recollection differs slightly from mine, the project died when we found that the creative freedoms some hoped for was not available and the economic model was not as good as it had originally been supposed. the finance was going to be a difficult sell. I wonder what you see as the hard part, because as you say getting people to do the creative story and outline artwork is not it.

 

[J. Mandrake]

i think your recollection differs slightly from mine, the project died when we found that the creative freedoms some hoped for was not available and the economic model was not as good as it had originally been supposed. the finance was going to be a difficult sell. I wonder what you see as the hard part, because as you say getting people to do the creative story and outline artwork is not it.

I had thought of Ozi as our leader, it all kind of fell apart when he left, in my opinion. I agree, the financial and creative aspects caused some discouragement, and there was a lot of debate about the prospect of making our own game instead. I do not intend for that debate to even take place here, this project is for people who want to work on a Planet, not another MMO entirely. I think a lot of us going into the old project went in with the wrong expectations. We couldn't really be blamed for it, as we didn't have much previous knowledge of what Planet Partners would be allowed to do. But this time, I think everyone onboard should know that we are developing a planet, and to avoid confusion, I will try and explain what that entails, thank you for reminding me. But just because we failed once doesn't mean it is impossible.