Shouldn't 2nd Avatars be hunted and banned?

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LeWolf86

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Just to spin off the other topic which is a poll about whether its obvious or not....


Personally I think having a 2nd avatar should be tracked my MA and removed.... there are many people who abuse it.... obviously if you craft/mine/hunt with second avatar thats ok since your putting back into the system and it doesn't matter which avatar you use.... but for those who abuse the extra auction slots and the abuses you can do with multiple trading areas and all other sorts of things that can be abused.... shouldn't MA step it up to try and stop em?

I know its hard to prove since it could be another family member... but shouldn't it be obvious when both avatars aren't active at the same time? Or their activity is maybe handicapped by the fact you cant play two at the same properly....
 

Tamn

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I know several people who I'm 80% sure have second ava's. But It is kind of hard to prove unless their on follow fapping all day every day.

But yea, I think its totally unfair and more action should be taken.
 

tayra

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I tend to agree with you on this, and that 2nd avatars should be banned, but this puts me in a difficult position - in that myself and 2 other members of my household play the game - all on the one computer and isp.

I admit that the others dont play much but only one of us can play at a time. SO how can MA tell who is playing? the only way that they could really enforce it is by making it one avatar per isp address, and thats hardly fair for someone in our position.

What is the solution , to be fair to all that want to play? I have no idea but I would hate to see people banned for having a second avatar, when in fact they dont, just one ISP.
 

garci

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depends of what the 2nd avatar is doing
if it's just for trading, or share items between a group of player, it's not that awfull
 

jdegre

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obviously if you craft/mine/hunt with second avatar thats ok since your putting back into the system and it doesn't matter which avatar you use....

well, i think the "obviously" applies in the exact opposite direction. it is "obvious" that, if 2nd ava's are forbidden, then they are forbidden no matter what.

bottomline is that what's "obvious" is different for everyone, and therefore, it is for MA to track down and take action on whatever irregularities they detect, if any.
 

aia

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depends of what the 2nd avatar is doing
if it's just for trading, or share items between a group of player, it's not that awfull

As for trading: It's an unfair advantage over traders who follow the rules. For instance, max number of items allowed on auction at a time.

As for using an avatar as a way of sharing items between a group of players: Bad argument that to. Not an uncommon scenario is that one player in the group is a scammer, and then the dilemma for MA would be to lock other players in the group or not if the scammer uses the shared avatar to stash away stolen goods with (argus bank, anyone?). Also, again, it can be an unfair advatage to have access to +200 carried and +500 storage points against the players who are following the rules and have to buy boxes and/or apartments.

I wouldn't mind a secondary avatar either, especially when planets come online for things like exploring and not having to pay TP fees when I want to hunt my normal mobs.

Or, imagine having a second avatar where I keep friends like pilots, traders and services which I need as reference but don't need access to daily - that is a second avatar to practically expand my friends list.
 

dandy

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The question is not the second avatar should be banned or not.

The question is how do you prove beyond the doubt that the second avatar is being used.

To prove is very costly.

1: MA calls you in the middle of the night if you are using the second avatar?

2: If second avatar is control by one person and not the member of your family?

3: If banned, what is the consequence if banned a wrong person?


cheer;


dandy
 

iancampbell

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aia, I think that it is extremely unlikely you won't be allowed second avatars on different planets. For one thing, the company you will actually be dealing with will be different when on (for example) Rocktropia. For another, if MA (NOT FPC) didn't allow it in those circumstances the new planets (or their controlling companies) would be at a gross disadvantage.

There might be an issue with avatars that start on one planet and cross to another, though.
 

Aeris_is_back

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If somebody is abusing the system with more then one avatar then yes, most internet resources are not active in looking for this kind of stuff though, they wait for a community member to report it.
 

exovirus

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Sadly there simply just isn't a guaranteed way to track this. I think the best that can be done is being done all ready.

The only way to more effectively police 2nd avatars would be t0o invasive to our privacy.
 

roughrider

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Just to spin off the other topic which is a poll about whether its obvious or not....


Personally I think having a 2nd avatar should be tracked my MA and removed.... there are many people who abuse it.... obviously if you craft/mine/hunt with second avatar thats ok since your putting back into the system and it doesn't matter which avatar you use.... but for those who abuse the extra auction slots and the abuses you can do with multiple trading areas and all other sorts of things that can be abused.... shouldn't MA step it up to try and stop em?

I know its hard to prove since it could be another family member... but shouldn't it be obvious when both avatars aren't active at the same time? Or their activity is maybe handicapped by the fact you cant play two at the same properly....

We have 3 accounts in our family. Me, my wife and my oldest daughter. We only have 2 pc's apable of playing EU so......
Besides, it is very rare that more than one of us is in att the same time.
# accounts, three credit cards, thats the proof I have that we aren't doing anything wrong.

It's impossible, and I mean IMPOSSIBLE, to prove that a single person has more than one account since the only definitave way to prove it is to physically monitor the person playing.

It's a dead end, we just have to live with it.
 

Naomi

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what is the problem?

What is the problem with people having a second avatar? I don't see it.

Market Manipulation.
Whether you do this with 2 avatars from yourself, or between yourself and a friend...
There are sneeky ppl everywhere, also in EU, and they will always find ways to do their sneeky actions.

Any other actions generates more income for MA, that includes a second avatar for crafting, scanning,...
 

Einstein

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You mean players are not allowed to have brothers or sisters anymore? :eek:

Is EU becoming the new China? :silly2:
 

saintvio

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honestly couldnt care less about second avatars and hope MA doesnt waste what little resources they seem to have working on this. think bringing back missing systems and launching planets is a better use of their time.
 

dilly

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Since it does clearly say in the EULA that you cannot have a second avatar, any which are active should be tracked down and deleted.
 

XarcX

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What is the problem with people having a second avatar? I don't see it.

Market Manipulation.
Whether you do this with 2 avatars from yourself, or between yourself and a friend...
There are sneeky ppl everywhere, also in EU, and they will always find ways to do their sneeky actions.

Any other actions generates more income for MA, that includes a second avatar for crafting, scanning,...

Well first its against the rules so thats a problem in its self. But it is also unfair for ppl following the rules only having one avatar. For example if both a secondary avatar and your main avatar is resellers you will have double the efficiency of selling things and also have double the storage and also the ability to transfer items between the avatars. Well that is some example. It is very unfair since it is against the rules and rules should be followed so everyone would be equal in this universe.
 

xgengrant

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Since it does clearly say in the EULA that you cannot have a second avatar, any which are active should be tracked down and deleted.

The only way you tell that one person owned two Avatar's , is if both showed the same owner & e-mail address . If they are diffrent , then even if they have the same IP they would be considered not owned by the same person.
 

Oleg

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I think the second avatar question is something of a diversion from the real issues.

If someone is scamming, manipulating market rates, or otherwise abusing the system, they should be locked. It makes no difference whether or not they have second avatars.

If someone manipulates the market using a second avatar, both the accounts should be locked. If two separate people use their own avatars to manipulate the market between them, both accounts should be locked. Both are the same thing.
 

Rockchick

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When Spike/Safara and I first started playing we only had one PC.. we would take it in turns to play PE an hour each. It was about a year before we got a second one. So that would mean that one of us would be banned :eek:

Its hard to work out who is a second avi and who is family on the same system. not sure how it could be done :dunno:
 

Jambayze

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I love it when I see Avatar's names like "Atrox Killer Dude" or "Hof Miner Hunter" where you know that the player who created this ava has played the game and this HAS to be a second avatar because how would they know that kind of name if they were really a newb?

(I did not use any real names here, I paraphrased, but you have all seen names where you say "WTF, how did they know a name like that unless they played before?")

I'm not talking about names like "Busty Chesty HotBabe" where you know this is just a 13 year old horny dude, but names that only make sense after you have played and want to start over or start a 2nd avatar.
 

SKULL

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When Spike/Safara and I first started playing we only had one PC.. we would take it in turns to play PE an hour each. It was about a year before we got a second one. So that would mean that one of us would be banned :eek:

Its hard to work out who is a second avi and who is family on the same system. not sure how it could be done :dunno:


why would that mean you got banned ?
2 real live ppl with each a own account np with that.
but the no second account avatar rule is easy to avoid in the way you did
(claiming your gf/sister/mother plays also
)so what the threadstarter said he they should be banned but this not possible


some avatars have clearly gotten their skills from AFK fapping
or an ATH from trapping a spider or using clickers for crafting

many more should be hunted and banned
 

Profit

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I have two accounts.
There's a difference between creating a new account and running two accounts simultaneously though, agreed?
 

SKULL

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I have two accounts.
There's a difference between creating a new account and running two accounts simultaneously though, agreed?

nope not according to the EULA
you may only have 1 account
 

Profit

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So how come MA know about it and haven't done anything negative towards me?
I created a second account, used it for a year, sold everything/gave everything away, then went back to using my first account. At this point I asked MA to close my second account stating something like "losses are too huge on this account I will use my old one from now on, please close this one".
:dunno:


[edit]
I still have access to both accounts on the website, but the second is now closed as per request (ie: I can't log into EU with it) but I am under the impression that if I were to ask, they would unlock it.
The only issue I had with switching between accounts was that MA needed scans of ID in order for me to use the CC's from my second account, on my first account.


Furthermore, it seems to me that if you signed up 100 accounts from the same PC and used 100 different names/emails etc... then there's nothing MA could do about it anyway. Especially if you could provide valid ID for all accounts (ie: use 100 friends who don't mind you scanning their ID).
It's pretty flawed in that sense.

In all honesty, I do agree 2nd accounts in the sense that both are being used simultaneously by one person, is not a good thing. But also, I believe there are sometimes valid reasons to have a 2nd account, such as starting over, using first avatar to learn the game before depo (what I did) etc... I don't think we should be punished - and I haven't - where valid reason is given.



ps: changing avatars won't stop the $1000+/week losses ;)
 
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Thantos

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I play another game where I have 3 accounts. The game maker encourages this because they make more money if I have more accounts. I don't really see the down side to this in EU either. I predict that this will eventually be like the auto clicker. MA will approve it and there will be no negative consequences to the economy. There will actually be more money pumped into the economy if people can have multiple accounts. Some people will argue that they don't have enough money to run two accounts so the people that can afford them have an advantage. That is not a valid arguement, because I can argue that I can't afford shadow and enough skill chips to get 250 health so anyone else that does it is cheating. As far as market manipulation goes, obviously MA can't do anything about it today, do it doesn't matter how many characters you have. Just my two pecs.
 

Etopia

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Just to spin off the other topic which is a poll about whether its obvious or not....


Personally I think having a 2nd avatar should be tracked my MA and removed.... there are many people who abuse it.... obviously if you craft/mine/hunt with second avatar thats ok since your putting back into the system and it doesn't matter which avatar you use.... but for those who abuse the extra auction slots and the abuses you can do with multiple trading areas and all other sorts of things that can be abused.... shouldn't MA step it up to try and stop em?

I know its hard to prove since it could be another family member... but shouldn't it be obvious when both avatars aren't active at the same time? Or their activity is maybe handicapped by the fact you cant play two at the same properly....

What can be abuse with 2 avatar beside market manipulation , but well you can do it with friend...so what is difference?
also , what can prove the 2 avatar are owned and played by the same person ?
 

Serica

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It would be fairly simple if everyone had a static ISP:

One account per ISP.

Where another account is created for the same IP address, acceptable ID could be required before the application is approved.
This would enable family members to play on the same computer/isp without problem.

For those creating accounts for 'improper' purposes (ie the reasons why MA only permits one account/person), there is probably a limit of how many family members would permit their personal ID to be used in this way.

For example, I cant see anyone even in my immediate family letting me use their personal ID documents to create a 2nd account in an online game.


My personal feeling about people with 2nd accounts:
If you're willing to lie to MA about who you are (and that's what you're doing every time you give false information), how can you expect me to trust you ?
 

Thantos

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It would be fairly simple if everyone had a static ISP:

One account per ISP.

Where another account is created for the same IP address, acceptable ID could be required before the application is approved.
This would enable family members to play on the same computer/isp without problem.

For those creating accounts for 'improper' purposes (ie the reasons why MA only permits one account/person), there is probably a limit of how many family members would permit their personal ID to be used in this way.

For example, I cant see anyone even in my immediate family letting me use their personal ID documents to create a 2nd account in an online game.


My personal feeling about people with 2nd accounts:
If you're willing to lie to MA about who you are (and that's what you're doing every time you give false information), how can you expect me to trust you ?

If you have 5 computers behind a router, MA will see the same IP for all of them.
 
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