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Version Update 10.6 Content List

Adamas said:
Where is Marco?!?!?

He said he'd be back today to answer questions after talking with MA.

Nothing like letting the coals smolder over time.
Click to expand...

I heard he lost his Mod Merc SGA in the crafting process of Tier 1, and went home to fondle someones girlfriend.
 
layla54 said:
hang on, I just realised with a 50% success rate (and Marco said that won't improve? I think) you have to run the gauntlet of upgrade risk twice, on average, per tier. So thats 2x 5% risk of 50k loss. So 10% risk, is that right?

Insane
Click to expand...

With the 50% success rate, the first chance is actually only 2.5% - you first have to fail (50% chance) and then you have to hit that 5% chance. If you only have a 5% chance out of 50%, that is only an overall 2.5% chance. If you have to go it again, it is the same thing, you get the 50/50 first.

With a 50% chance, the average number of attempts per tier is 1.5 attempts. That means 15 attempts at a compounding 2.5% chance.

To calculate the chance of losing even a single item, you need to take the initial 100% and start applying 2.5% reductions 15 times, each time applying the reduction to the NEW value. For example - first click has a 97.5% chance of no loss, 2.5% removed from 97.5 is 95.0625%. That is 2 clicks, you continue until 15 clicks. To save you the trouble:

Compounded average chance of NOT wasting a UL item due to item loss by click, rounded to two decimal places
1- 97.50
2- 95.06
3- 92.69
4- 90.37
5- 88.11
6- 85.91
7- 83.76
8- 81.67
9- 79.62
10- 77.63
11- 75.69
12- 73.80
13- 71.95
14- 70.16
15- 68.40

This means that to upgrade from Tier 0 to Tier 10 you will have a 32.6% chance of losing AT LEAST one UL item when each click is effectively a 2.5% chance. Still, as it is, that means you still need 11 copies of a single UL item to reach max tier (one base and 10 tiers).

This is only an AVERAGE, your luck will determine your actual losses. The average chance to NEVER fail on 1-10 leveling is 1/1024, or .097% chance.

Feeling lucky?
 
....How can i upgrade my Daikatana SGA?
It is only 1 ingame.....and i want upgrade it.
:eek::eek::eek:
 
I still don't see the point of needing to have 2 of an item to upgrade it. That's absolutely unneeded. I'm not spending PED to tier up a weapon and then shelling out ANOTHER x-amount of PED to get another weapon just like it.

I was so excited about this update and now that I see how messy it is, I'm really regretting it.



And I still can't get used to having hundreds of thousands of ammo at once. ME NO LIKEY :mad:
 
To save people the trouble of visiting ..

Marco said:
I hope to shed some light into the UnL-item Tier upgrade process introduced in VU10.6, as it is currently under speculation.

Let me start with that I have received information from MindArk that there is currently a bug present which blocks the skill and profession associated with the action of upgrading UnL-items. It will be fixed in a mini-update next week.

Please view the Tier Upgrade User Interface. When attempting to upgrade an unlimited item to the next major tier, a profession check is made against the Tier Upgrader profession. If the check is within the Success Rate percentage range the item is upgraded to the next major tier. The Secondary item (the copy of the upgraded item) is salvaged fully (meaning you get to keep the item). The rest of the ingredients are consumed. A percentage of the TT value of the consumed ingredients is added to the TT value of the upgraded item and any excess is returned as residue.

If the check is over the Success Rate percentage but within the Salvage Rate percentage range the item is not upgraded to the next major tier. The Secondary item is salvaged (you keep the item). The rest of the ingredients are consumed. A percentage of the TT value of the consumed ingredients is returned as residue.

If the check is over the Salvage Rate percentage the item is not upgraded to the next major tier. The Secondary item and the rest of the ingredients are consumed. A percentage of the TT value of the consumed ingredients is returned as residue.
Click to expand...

:)
 
I am not sure what Marco said. What does a profession check mean? Does one have to be a professional upgrader and have a certain skill lvl? Not to be rude but I kind of hope they make so complicated that I will never understand and quit getting a headache trying to figure out what they are saying:scratch2:.
Peace.
PS
What is the Tier Upgrade User Interface ? Is it something we can view now or is it only at the time of the upgrade?
Sorry Marco but I had to smile a little on what you said in the Under the Hood post, here it is:

"making it an easy system even for beginners. It also introduces a high level game to improve the best items to even higher levels, making the enhancement system something for both newcomers as well as veterans."

Sorry again, nothing personal:).
 
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Marco|FPC said:
Now you will.
Click to expand...

anyway , one of the main problem is not if the ingredien are burn or not in fail....
For now , the problem is the need to burn a "copy" of the item you want to upgrade...

That mean this sytem is only to be use by L item , and by some craftable cheap UL item...
Most of the UL item will never be upgrade , due to the need of the next item...

This mean , 90% of the player base , who work their ass to get some valuable UL item(mainly with big deposit) , can not use the new feature...


I understand MA dont whant to see some player have tier 10 Mod Merc SGA ( but who created such over un balanced item ?) ... but then there was many solution to make it.
for exemple make the tier unlock with HP killed , and put a very very big number, or use very rare ingredien to alow the upgrade... if 2 or 3 big item get upgrade per year its not end of EU...
But , this would have make the things looks a bit ridiculous , but at least give hope to player...

What that new feature managed to do , is to remouve the hope at 90% of player to get better in future...

I think it sad , and stupid , to waste a nice feature like this one , due to stupid requirement to use it...

Many player did ask for such things for many years ...yet you make it a way they can not use it ...

It remind me the story of the armless kid jumping in front of a shelf screaming " mum , chocolate , mum , chocolate"...and his mother watch him and say " no arm , no chocolate"...
 
Etopia said:
anyway , one of the main problem is not if the ingredien are burn or not in fail....
For now , the problem is the need to burn a "copy" of the item you want to upgrade...

That mean this sytem is only to be use by L item , and by some craftable cheap UL item...
Most of the UL item will never be upgrade , due to the need of the next item...

This mean , 90% of the player base , who work their ass to get some valuable UL item(mainly with big deposit) , can not use the new feature...


I understand MA dont whant to see some player have tier 10 Mod Merc SGA ( but who created such over un balanced item ?) ... but then there was many solution to make it.
for exemple make the tier unlock with HP killed , and put a very very big number, or use very rare ingredien to alow the upgrade... if 2 or 3 big item get upgrade per year its not end of EU...
But , this would have make the things looks a bit ridiculous , but at least give hope to player...

What that new feature managed to do , is to remouve the hope at 90% of player to get better in future...

I think it sad , and stupid , to waste a nice feature like this one , due to stupid requirement to use it...

Many player did ask for such things for many years ...yet you make it a way they can not use it ...

It remind me the story of the armless kid jumping in front of a shelf screaming " mum , chocolate , mum , chocolate"...and his mother watch him and say " no arm , no chocolate"...
Click to expand...

well it only a 5 % chance at the first tier 1 upgrade to "lose" the second item so someones will take the chance.
 
billairboy said:
well it only a 5 % chance at the first tier 1 upgrade to "lose" the second item so someones will take the chance.
Click to expand...

If I look at our "chances" at crafting (bp quality 100%) if you got some decent skills, 5% still sounds dangerous with higher end items. :)
 
billairboy said:
well it only a 5 % chance at the first tier 1 upgrade to "lose" the second item so someones will take the chance.
Click to expand...

Yes - but we still have to buy a second item.

There is no secure loaning system in-game to borrow them.
 
billairboy said:
well it only a 5 % chance at the first tier 1 upgrade to "lose" the second item so someones will take the chance.
Click to expand...

But there is 100% you lose it if you success...

If i did understand good , the second item is part of the ingredien , and all ingredien are burned during the process ( like in crafting).

Or did i missunderstood something?
 
double post
 
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Marco|FPC said:
Yes, you missunderstood. https://www.planetcalypsoforum.com/forums/mindark-news/174048-major-tier-upgrade-process.html
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Thanks for reply :)

I still think the idea of requiring the same item for upgrade make the whole system scary...
I do think the introduction of 10 or 20 new ingredien required for the upgrade would not have mess up the loot or the DB , and the player would not have get so scared and feeled so bad...



Brooklyn said:
:scratch2:
I think that you need to create a series of visual diagramatic steps for this crowd



Perhaps even a new section in the FPC guides

"New Systems for Old Timers"
:yup:​
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You must admit the explenation of the whole system was a bit confusing...Its a bit strange that 1 of the ingredien is maybe not consumed...

IMHO , some part of the sytem have not be think to be logic for player...
Using million of amo dont make sence....Ingredien that may not be used dont make sence... need 2 item to make an upgrade dont make sence...

EU is a futuristic game , populated with many people who work close to computeur , and often , sci-fie fan.
It would be nice that EU go back a bit on some logic...
I dont want evrything to be total realistic , but at least follow a way that make some sence...
EU is a cash economie , but it seems latelly , the pure economie mathermatic overhelm the game logic and mecanic...
 
I would like Marco to answer one question if he will.

What exactly is the thinking behind having to have a second item of the same kind to do an upgrade ?

It seems that it would be a deterrent for upgrading anything with a high value. I have an Embra Laser Sword C1 (UL) with a min TT value of about 1450 Ped, moreover there are only 6 or 7 in the game, as near as I can tell, and I don't even see how I could ever get another to use in the upgrade process. Even if I could get another I don't think I would take the chance.

I hope we can get answer but I am expecting silence.
Peace.
 
Ok lets see then...

So you need 2 identical items to be able to upgrade one of them, that means you either have to buy an extra one you dont really need with all the crap that comes along with buying/selling (for every Tier even if you cant afford to keep an extra one in storage thats just sitting there for no reason until you need it again...).
Btw keeping extras of most stuff in storage seems downright stupid instead of them being on avatars using them. Trading ok, but because you might need it for a tier in a month?...

So... if you dont have extra money available youre forced to lend one from someone. Since there is no secure way of lending anything ingame atm you need to both have people that trust you to a very very high degree + you have to be lucky that someone in the "trusting category" owns the same item as you do and is willing to lend it out to you.

To add to that it is also skillbased apparently, which means unless you or that trusted friend have enough skills to do this on your own, you will also have to trust someone else with the required skill to "lend" both items (regardless if they come from yourself or one is borrowed its not really something alot of people want to do, unless they know the person VERY well now is it...) to do this upgrade for you?

Im very happy the risk of losing expensive items to upgrade tiers seem to have been "removed" again (if it was ever there, was sure as hell explained like that to begin with).

But... looking through what i just wrote above i see either a world of scams waiting to happen since far from all people will have both the skills and the ability to buy 2 identical items to do this themselves (i.e. no moving of items between different avatars) and as soon as "lending" happens there will be scams, history tought us that pretty well in here now didnt it...
Second option being those that dont even have the option of borrowing/buying etc and thus wont be able to upgrade, ever, which cant be the idea here can it?

That its supposed to be hard to get to Tier 10 (especially on top end items) i can fully understand, but this resembles the highlvl (L)FAP problem where were talking "impossible" and "stupid" instead of "very hard" unless you have unbelievable amounts of cash to spend.

Ah well might be some more stuff coming i guess, since atm it still looks like a really cool idea to me, but gotta admit the current "rules" seem slightly... silly still.
 
CozMoDan said:
What exactly is the thinking behind having to have a second item of the same kind to do an upgrade ?
Click to expand...

There was thought behind it?! :eek: :rolleyes:

I know an Upgrade Replicator has been mentioned so why not just have more bp's or loot drops of those (however they are going to arrive in game) and totally remove the need for the identical 2nd item? Or do we need 1000+ of them already to upgrade depending on tt or uberness of items and they will drop so rarely it will take a year or more to upgrade? I guess we won't know until one finally appears.
 
Question... when I use to loot 350 Ammo, or 3.5 ped and now that is divided by 100... what happens to the fractions of pec? Am I getting robbed?
 
Congadawg said:
Question... when I use to loot 350 Ammo, or 3.5 ped and now that is divided by 100... what happens to the fractions of pec? Am I getting robbed?
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I wonder what happens when i TT 140 ammo for 1 pec....is the 40 ammo just fake return.. nooooo it's goin somewhere. It's a real pain in the arse but i have to split all the ammo now b4 selling to TT and store up all the fractional ammo till i get a TT value... as i said, it's a real pain the arse. If it continues this way it will certainly end my days of hunting. Maybe then i join the happy people that sweat in a relaxing environment that has a swimming pool and nice trees.
 
Hellraizer said:
I wonder what happens when i TT 140 ammo for 1 pec....is the 40 ammo just fake return.. nooooo it's goin somewhere. It's a real pain in the arse but i have to split all the ammo now b4 selling to TT and store up all the fractional ammo till i get a TT value... as i said, it's a real pain the arse. If it continues this way it will certainly end my days of hunting. Maybe then i join the happy people that sweat in a relaxing environment that has a swimming pool and nice trees.
Click to expand...
EU ped card was using 5 digit after the . or , before this update...
Mean you ped card was not 45.65 ped but 45.65895
But , you did not know since evrything is rounded up when display.
so , your amo should not be loss , just it does nor show up...
you can do test by TTing stack of 10 amo to see when it round up... it will be probably before you TTed a full pec of it.
 
Etopia said:
EU ped card was using 5 digit after the . or , before this update...
Mean you ped card was not 45.65 ped but 45.65895
But , you did not know since evrything is rounded up when display.
so , your amo should not be loss , just it does nor show up...
you can do test by TTing stack of 10 amo to see when it round up... it will be probably before you TTed a full pec of it.
Click to expand...

if i loot 150 ammo the TT rounds it down to 1 pec so ofc if i TT it i lose that 50 ammo.. if i keep that 50 ammo then get another 50 ammo in loot i can then get the 1 pec for it so ofc if i TT 150 ammo i lose out. I really shoudnlt be expected to to fanny about working out the the point of which it's rounded up, but i have a feeling it's at 65 but that may have been a dream.. anyway.. it's far too much fannying about for my liking.
 
Hellraizer said:
if i loot 150 ammo the TT rounds it down to 1 pec so ofc if i TT it i lose that 50 ammo.. if i keep that 50 ammo then get another 50 ammo in loot i can then get the 1 pec for it so ofc if i TT 150 ammo i lose out. I really shoudnlt be expected to to fanny about working out the the point of which it's rounded up, but i have a feeling it's at 65 but that may have been a dream.. anyway.. it's far too much fannying about for my liking.
Click to expand...

Read again.

You don't have to do this, the micropecs are stored on your card, you just can't see them.
 
I did take a look at the BP book and tier lvl upgrade takes a BP from lvl 1-10. I have done some crafting but I think I can only do about a lvl 2 BP with good success rate and that is probably 3000 or 4000 ped worth of crafting.
What I think is that leaves me to either buy an enhancer above lvl two or just do without because I only have a couple of UL weapons and only one I would chance losing and that being a TT sword. I am not sure how much pratice it takes to progress in enhancer crafting but I don't think I will have enough peds to get past the lvl I am at, if even that crafting applies which it probably does not:(. Not very good for me.
Peace.
 
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